Jump to content
  • "when's e19?"- a development update


    andracass

    serious post.

    it's been a bit over a year since i wrote the post announcing postgame. it's been about two years since e18 came out. people have been wondering things like "is the game dead?" and "where's e19?". while these sorts of questions tend to be a little annoying when asked reasonably near an episode's release date, we've reached a time when they become appropriate, legitimate questions. so let's talk about what's going on.

     

    the biggest thing is starlight

    for those of you who do not know, ame is currently also working on Starlight Divide, a tRPG that will be her next game after reborn is done. she is developing it entirely from scratch. development for it began basically right after the story for e19 was finished/functional and it has been continuing pretty much since then.

    developing from scratch is hard.

    fangame development has a few advantages in that the mechanics have been laid out by gamefreak (for better or for worse) and essentials offers a base set of tools to build games from (for better or for worse). in no way does this imply that developing quality content is easy, but it is still fairly simple to pick up some tools and get going.

    starlight does not have that. after being worked on for a year, it has almost approached the point of being playable. and then there's an entire game that needs to be made on top of it.

     

    the reason starlight is an issue for e19 is because of timing.

    the original plan for development was something like: e19m -> starlight -> starlight demo release -> e19p -> e19 release.

    (i use e19m as shorthand for the main story and e19p as shorthand for postgame.)

    this order was decided for a lot of reasons. there's general reborn burnout, ame wanted to start a new project, hiding from the big N (hi reggy thx 4 ur mercy), it provides some amount of project continuity, among other things.

    this order was decided a year ago. i'll just straight-up say that, in hindsight, this was a mistake. i don't think we were expecting the demo to take so long, nor did we account for the development pressure of working on two games concurrently. not releasing new content for two years is a bit anxiety-provoking.

    at this point, the starlight demo is probably going to be finished first, so realizing that the development plan was a mistake isn't going to result in it changing. this is basically just an explanation for why things have taken so long.

     

    i also want to talk about progress bars.

    i've noticed that a lot of discussions about development (and this would also apply to rejuv and deso a bit as well) will occasionally include a mention of "the game is at X% and that means [something]!" in reborn's case, the thing that it "means" is that the game has hovered around 52% completion for a while and thus there has been no development on the game.

    that is not even remotely true.

    to be fair, i suspect that the people who assume there has been no development are also not reading anything i say here (including this! fuck.), but it also says something about what people think when they see the numbers on the little sidebar over there. --->

    the progress bar numbers are made up. 

    (by me, i should add.)

    the point of the progress bars is to offer a condensed look at what we've done and what we plan to do. the X% of the bottom is there to give some kind of impression of what the overall progress looks like.

    I sure don't fuckin know what the overall progress looks like.

    the progress bars are basically calculated by me looking at various aspects of the game and going "eh, sure, this can be 3% of the total!" and then adding up all those shitty guesses i'm making.

    the problem then is that the bars are structured around what we expect to be working on- which usually involves game content.

    none of those guesses involved MKXP, or the massive, ridiculous amounts of code cleanup we've been doing. that number probably isn't even going to move until the starlight demo come out since ame tends to work on the game content. there's more stuff that we're planning to do in the future that i also already know won't be represented in the progress bars. the X% at the bottom is practically lying to you. 

    because of this, it's tempting to pull the bars down until reborn development picks up. in their current state, they're kind of a pain in the ass for everyone: i have to keep them up to date, they put pressure on the development team to overwork since there's a lot of stuff to do, and it makes everyone watching them impatient for the next release. (in fact, i think i just convinced myself that taking them down is a good idea and should probably be done.)

     

    we know that there's a lot of people hyped up for e19, and so I really want to make it clear that we will be playing everything regarding its development completely straight. when development picks up again I will tell you. when we're going to start testing soon I will tell you. when we're planning to do a community release I will tell you.

    (or, well, someone will. i've taken point on a lot of this lately but it won't necessarily be me.)

     

    so, in the interests of transparency...

    gen 8

    i hope i don't regret this

    marcello wants to do it and i don't. that's the short version. the real version is a lot more complicated.

    will it be in e19? it is highly likely no. it'd involved redoing a lot of work that's been done on the game since e18 (much of which was done by me, hence my bias) and i think it'd be really putting way too much pressure on development/testing to implement it across the whole game. it'd also add on a lot of extra dev time to a release that is already massive. i say it's "highly likely no" because there are circumstances under which this may change, such as the current development slowdown stretching into next year and, thus, allowing some time for us to get everything implemented. the DLC may also influence this.

    will it come out after e19? maybe! it's still way too soon to talk about what happens after e19 since a lot can change between now and then, but I don't think there'd be any reason to avoid a DLC-esque update after the game is done. there's some other stuff we may want to do then, too (hard mode, maybe).

     

    i feel like there's more that I need to say... but i'm basically out of things to say.

    in short, don't panic. we're working on it.

    • Like 66
    • Thanks 21
    • Sad 1
    • Upvote 6


    User Feedback

    Recommended Comments

    My takeaway from this post is Ame is making a different great game in addition to this great game and I look forward to playing them both

    • Like 7
    • Upvote 2

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    Guest

    Posted (edited)

    Literally just joined to make a post about this, since I figured you were gonna have to speak up about this sooner or later.  And that said, yeah, I've been checking on the progress bars, but I already know how arduous, frustrating, and outright convoluted game development can be--like, "what the fuck just happened" sorts of things.

     

    Sounds like you've already got some stories to tell, yeah?

     

    But I just wanna say, thanks for speaking up about this.  I have an interest in game development myself, though it'll be a while before I can actually pursue it.  One thing I do know is that it's a lot harder than many people think for devs to speak out about these things (a lot of times, it's just to avoid disappointing fans); if you're working for one of those big-name studios, it's even worse before you have to sign NDAs and wade through all the corporate BS and basically take all the shit fans sling at you for things that aren't even your fault to begin with without saying/doing anything in response for the sake of your job.  I know all that big-name studio/corporate stuff isn't what's going on here, but I couldn't help noticing some parallels, so yeah.

     

    Games take a lot of time and effort.  Or at least, genuinely good games do.  Even if they're using pre-existing tools and assets like Reborn/Rejuv/etc.

     

    So, don't worry too much about it--I and probably quite a few others here (most, hopefully) know that the best answer you can give right now is "it'll be done when it's done."  And I mean, yeah, I know you and Ame and the others on the team already know this stuff from experience, but I'm pretty sure it helps to have some support from the outside.

     

    It's kinda sounding like focusing solely on Starlight for now would be a good idea, but I'm not gonna tell you what to do.  Just know that if you do decide to hide Reborn's progress bars and put the project on hold for the time being, I'll support that.

    Edited by Guest

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    Hi guys. I might be a new member to this community since I just joined it a few weeks ago, but I actually started playing Reborn 7 years ago (I remember that Julia still has an Emolga, and the Tourmaline Desert is not done yet).

     

    I was young then. And stupid. I tried brute-forcing my way through every battle. It went about as well as you would expect. So I quit. I remembered exactly the point when I decided to quit. That damn Cradily.

     

    Fast forward to last year. Say what you want about USUM being a handholding game, but it reignited my interest in playing Pokemon again. So I recalled a certain Pokemon game which I abandoned years ago, and I typed it into the Google search bar, and lo and behold, there was this vibrant community behind this huge Pokemon Reborn. I put off playing again until I did my research this time, so I learned everything I could. I did it. I beat the damn Cradily that caused me to quit last time. And then the Crobat, the Volbeat, the Mimikyu (I remembered him having Chandelure before, but since I never got to this point, I don't know, my friend did). I beat Hardy two weeks ago. It's a rollercoaster. 

     

    And surprisingly the community is supportive. Which is more than I can say about the community of some games. So, thank you everyone. Thank you Ame. And Cass. And everyone on the dev team. I'm a fan. If you decide to postpone the development of the game for the time being, I understand and support you. 

     

    In the meantime, we'll just enjoy this great world you've worked so hard to make. Hiding the progress bars is a good idea. It reduces anxiety (out of sight, out of mind, right).

     

     

     

    • Like 6

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    I could care less if Gen 8 Pokemon are added to the game. Sure I'll miss out on some of the pokemon that I liked. But at this point I'm just wanting to see how the story for Pokemon Reborn plays out.  I know it's been some time since Ep18, but that's to be expected. I hope that the workings for Starlight and Pokemon Reborn's final Episode goes well. It's been fun struggling through the game. I know you guys can do it.

    • Like 2

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    I know that you all form the Development Team are with too much pressure and, of course, much of that is our fault as fans(basically all actually). Naturally, we all want to know what will be the end of our beloved game and have many hopes about how E19 will turn out to be, but no matter what, the true fans will LOVE the game and will wait all the time you need for completing it. Although I might have no place to say that, since I am no represantive or any crap like that(neither would like to be) I'd like to say for all the players of Reborn that we are so thankful for all yours, Ame's and all the team´s hard work and tell you to take your time that we'll understand. Sorry for the long text, but after this post, I felt that someone needed to say something about all this pressure we have put on the game's development and apolozige for that. I think that is enough for a comment, so take care you all folks( and plz wash your hands Cass xD)

    • Like 1

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    5 hours ago, Amethyst said:

    i appreciate u cass

    and yeah
    i have so many regrets
    i've committed to them, but regrets nonetheless
    i really appreciate everyone's patience here

     

    but have a snippet of one of starlight's maps just so you can see a little bit of what we're working on here.

    There's no need for regrets for what's been done... its already been done and regret wont help. Keep doing ya thing, take one step at a time and be proud you've come this far. The game will reach its completion.

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    Damn you guys all deserve a big rest... Appreciate all you guys for all you do, seriously... Don't overwork yourselves and work at your own pace! 😔✊🏾

    • Like 1

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    I also come here to join here and I'm saying... I'm very sorry, that I plagued you with endless questions etc. about the Ep19 and didn't know you were working on another fangame (though it was an anime or something). It's must be very tired and hard😵😓🙏🏼

     

    Also it's our fault as fans- like a few there said- we pressure you the development team instead of appreciate years of hard work. It's admirable😊

     

    Mainly it's because, that the hype is currently over 9000 on us and we cannot wait, what's going to happen next. The feeling, when you planned at one part, which will grow into more excitement but then suddenly, the part/chapter/episode ends at the most crucial point and then we have to wait like ages to get the finale- leaving us with lots of questions.

     

    But I'm still hoping, that perhaps it will release at this year or maybe at the beginning of 2021. Judging by this timeline👇🏽

     

    Spoiler

    The Game Timeline of Pokemon Reborn (2012- ????)

     

    Episode 1: April 17, 2012
    Episode 2: May 28, 2012
    Episode 3: August, 2012
    Episode 4: September 29, 2012
    Episode 5: November 2, 2012
    Episode 6: February 3, 2013
    Episode 7: March 24, 2013
    Episode 8: May 22, 2013
    Episode 9: July 26, 2013
    Episode 10: November 9, 2013
    Episode 11: March 8, 2014
    Episode 12: April 1, 2014
    Episode 13: September 6, 2014
    Episode 14: December 15, 2014
    Episode 15: June 9, 2015
    Episode 16: December 14, 2016
    Episode 17: Decembee 24, 2017(OFS's point so far)
    Episode 18: August 22, 2018(Current Release)

     

    But let's just advice the people and ourselves, to take a break from frequently asking the same issue and wait awhile till the time is round like a full moon🌕

     

    Spoiler

    🤗💐Thank you for years of fun and uniting people together🤗💐

    2226340a0ri1j2lkm.gif.876e2a6445662f0cec84215ce9237116.gif

     

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    Sad for the pause... But on the other hand, Starlight looks nice, interesting and promising, so wishing for its success would do. That and everybody suspected that, from those regulars in here; now it's merely worded and made official. Nobody from the true fans will nag; on the contrary, they will support you, cheer you up and wellwish for the project. I will plead you to not incorporate gen 8 though, because movelists and abilities change, reducing the fun factor a bit, even though that's nothing when compared against Gengar losing Levitate and many other previous nerfs, due to new generation (7) rules. Instead, i will urge you to polish up the gen 7 and correct the various issues still persisting. Especially the errors in movelists and moves learned; one readily available example, is Move tutor being unable to teach Iron Head to Mamoswine. Reborn is just about perfect, with a fully functional and well ironed out (hopefully), generation 7! Adding Meltan-Melmetal though, i won't say no to that! Cheers!

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    1 hour ago, Evi Crystal said:

    But I'm still hoping, that perhaps it will release at this year or maybe at the beginning of 2021. 

    Reborn will not be releasing at any point this year. 

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    Quote

    to be fair, i suspect that the people who assume there has been no development are also not reading anything i say here (including this! fuck.)

    How dare they

     

    I'm pretty sure I've read every update on AI, cleaning code and stuff and while I understood roughly half of it, I remember you saying that you were working more than sleeping. Hope you're chilling right now.

     

    And, um, pls no gen 8?

    Edited by Logan_the_balalaika
    • Upvote 2

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    Please, you are doing us a service here, not the other way around, everyone who got to enjoy this game should be thankful. I assume I speak for many others when I say that the whole development team deserves a great amount of respect. Every development update has got me excited and reading them has been a blast so far. Please, take all the time you need, and thank you.

    • Like 1
    • Thanks 1
    • Upvote 2

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    3 hours ago, Abyssreaper99 said:

    Reborn will not be releasing at any point this year. 

    Okay then, but I'll be patient and not bother anymore. Thanks for that🙂

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    so no gen8, i'm totally fine with that. it'll simply overcrowd the game. other than that, i'm sad that ep19 won't be released this year. but i understand that developing a fangame takes time. so i'm prepared to wait for 1 or 2 years until ep19 comes out.

    b'coz i know that it'll be amazing and the perfect finish to the game

     

     

    Edited by sayar

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    Thanks a lot for the update!

     

    I'll miss the progress bars since they do look great, but I get that it gets frustrating when people put so much meaning into it when it really doesn't mean that much. 

     

    Good to see we are keeping the updates though, those are cute :3 

     

    Also

    15 hours ago, Amethyst said:

    but have a snippet of one of starlight's maps just so you can see a little bit of what we're working on here.

     

      Reveal hidden contents

     

     


    Screenshot_1.png
     

     

     

    we're getting there.

     

    What a way to get me hyped, that looks good!

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    I've been waiting for it for 2 years and I will keep waiting. I'm in no need of an annual release or such nonsense, yes I'm looking at you Gamefreak, I just want a quality Pokemon game. And I'm certain that the wait will be well worth it. This is and most likely always will be my favorite Pokemon game to ever exist, and while my expectations of the main series keep going down to the point of being outright uninterested, I'm glad to be able to look forward to at least one more great adventure to be had. Just want to say thank you for all your hard work, and even if it takes another 2 years or more, I will be here, waiting.

    • Like 1
    • Upvote 1

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    Hello,

     

    Just wanted to send good vibes^^

     

    I like reborn, i'm desperately waiting for ep 19 since 2 years BUT Reborn is a high quality game I would be sad if the end was rush, he's worth the waiting.

     

    I understand it's difficult to keep the same motivation for a project over time, sometimes there is high period, sometimes low, other project and hype come up in mind, ... and like you said before it's difficult to estimate that something is completely done.

     

    I don't know how you doing, where you doing it or whatever, i just wanted you to know that you're doing great, so be happy and, eventually launch Ep19 (but stay cool first and take as long time as you want^^)

     

    Here's the vibe:

    (> ^_^ )> ~~

    • Like 1

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    I Would say Reborn is worth the wait. I actually don't mind if Gen 8 is left out. It is good as it is. I started Reborn maybe when Episode 15 was released I think. I picked it back up now and currently playing through. Although the wait is hard, I understand.

     

    Quote

    I've been waiting for it for 2 years and I will keep waiting. I'm in no need of an annual release or such nonsense, yes I'm looking at you Gamefreak, I just want a quality Pokemon game. And I'm certain that the wait will be well worth it. This is and most likely always will be my favorite Pokemon game to ever exist, and while my expectations of the main series keep going down to the point of being outright uninterested, I'm glad to be able to look forward to at least one more great adventure to be had. Just want to say thank you for all your hard work, and even if it takes another 2 years or more, I will be here, waiting.

    Lol Gamefreak screwed up there. They were so pressured into yearly releases that the games became sub par.

    I would say not to add Gen 8 so that it becomes a little easier for you guys. The story is awesome as it is. And as T3RR4 would say RAAAAAWWWWWWWRRRR!!

    • Upvote 1

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    I really hope Gen 8 doesn't get added. I might be biased because I didn't like Gen 7 and stopped playing the main series after that, but Gen 8 would complicate many things. First, it removed more moves and Pokémon than it added, so would those moves also be removed and if not, would that break the balance? Some Pokémon getting stat and movelist improvements while others don't would probably skew the balance as well. Also Dynamaxing is just a boring mechanic.

     

    I remember the point where it was said that Gen 7 wouldn't be added to the game and I would have been happy with that as I liked the Pokémon selection and balance in Gen 6. Although Gen 7 did some fine adjustments to status ailments, it was also the point where GameFreak started unnaturally overbalancing some things. Dark Void's accuracy getting reduced from 80% to 50% is just ridiculous.

    • Like 2

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    I dont know how many times this has been asked, probably a lot, and I dont feel like checking, but can some1 explain pls why e19 main and e19 postgame arent separate releases? Especially since all the main stuff has been done?

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    Well I'm just happy to enjoy such a great iteration of a pokemon game you guys made.

    I don't care how much it ends up taking, great things take time, creators have a life outside the game, and complaining about not finishing a story ASAP doesn't do it for me (specially after Half Life)

    Just the fact that you guys keep posting even a coding change or whatever signs of life and not being MIA is enough for me to continue to come here
     

    • Upvote 1

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    56 minutes ago, heloo5t5 said:

    I dont know how many times this has been asked, probably a lot, and I dont feel like checking, but can some1 explain pls why e19 main and e19 postgame arent separate releases? Especially since all the main stuff has been done?

    A release of the finished version might draw the attention of a certain video game company. The main game was fully finished and tested though, in case they have to drop the project for any reason.

     

    I think it's also a good design choice. After finishing a great game people are usually hyped for what the post game has to offer. After finishing a great game and waiting a year maybe not as much anymore.

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    This is gonna be lit! You're telling me these legendary story writers and game developers are making another game that well eventually get to ply? that's awesome, can't wait. Keep up the good work 🙂

    • Like 1

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
     
     
    hi i'm new here in the community i played reborn a little bit ahead of the battle with Noel but i stopped playing when i found out the game wasn't complete so i would like to know if you intend to finish the game on e19
    • Hmm 4

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    Honestly I was hoping this wasn't going to happen but what can you do?Hopefully Starlights development goes smoothly enough and I'll look forward to e19 in 2021. :]

    • Sad 1

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites


    Guest
    This is now closed for further comments

  • hello. the progress bars are in storage. you can read about why here.

    and, no, the game is not cancelled. it's okay.

    (Updated 8/25)

  • 16-4.png
    16-5.png
    16-6.png
    16-7.png
    16-8.png
    16-11.png
    16-12.png

×
×
  • Create New...