The Last, Only, and Very Final X% Hype Thread

[Green Bean 501]

1 hour ago, Oscarus said:

I've never thought of the event of Sinjoh Ruins as canon in any capacity - it does show how strong and potent Arceus is... But that's all. 

• Also... Do you remember what happens when two Gods and/or God-like Pokemon clash with each other? (from the movies, or games) If any of the created in the Sinjoh Ruins Pokemon met their "real" counterpart... Let's say that the citizens of the nearby regions should evacuate immediately if that happened 

I always figured that event was just to show how much power Arceus really has. But recently I actually got a crazy idea. What if Arceus creates a new legendary for each one that gets captured? That would explain how all the protagonists can store god like beings in a computer indefinitely without the world getting fucked up

[Oscarus]

1 hour ago, KingInfernal said:

If one gyarados can destroy entire cities, i don't want imagine two Palkia...

 

(Yes, i know that we don't have to take dex entries literally)

We theorically don't have to, but some of them make sense. Plus... Lance's Dragonair in the manga could wipe out entire Vermilion with a single Hyper Beam.

A Dragonair, with one move, destroyed and killed entire city. Yes, it is a Pokemon of Elite Four, soon-to-be Champion, but that isn't even his ace. 

I know it is just in manga... But it shows how Pokemon can truly be destructive, ignoring limits of game logic and PG-7 enivoriment of the anime 

[Bananacake887]

1 hour ago, Oscarus said:

We theorically don't have to, but some of them make sense. Plus... Lance's Dragonair in the manga could wipe out entire Vermilion with a single Hyper Beam.

A Dragonair, with one move, destroyed and killed entire city. Yes, it is a Pokemon of Elite Four, soon-to-be Champion, but that isn't even his ace. 

I know it is just in manga... But it shows how Pokemon can truly be destructive, ignoring limits of game logic and PG-7 enivoriment of the anime 

Dragonair's been eating their vegetables

[Oscarus]

21 hours ago, Green Bean 501 said:

What if Arceus creates a new legendary for each one that gets captured? That would explain how all the protagonists can store god like beings in a computer indefinitely without the world getting fucked up

That's, uh, how to put it simply............ 

wack. 

 

In game, that would make some sense. In lore, that's a recipe for catastrophe - if those who capture those are using them, and will face the other one who also possesses such Legendary. 

Of course, assuming they'll be limiting each other, and some additional safety purposes will be added (such as barriers separating arena from the audience; like in battle between Lance and Leon), said battle could function like any other. But without it... 

22 hours ago, KingInfernal said:

If any of the created in the Sinjoh Ruins Pokemon met their "real" counterpart... Let's say that the citizens of the nearby regions should evacuate immediately if that happened

...you get the idea. 

[Oscarus]

Hey. Now I've noticed... 

Ace, despite appearing at the story's end, is said to "have such a presence like they've been there the whole time". 

Do you know what other major antagonist appeared basically at the end of the main plot, but in summary it was like they'd been in the story since the beginning? 

Steven Armstrong 

 

His "real" debut was the very final moments and battles of Metal Gear Rising: Revengance. Still, during the cutscenes and his dialogues with Raiden, you slowly realize that he - throughout the entire plot - was intervening and controlling most of the events of that game: from assassinating Nmami to entire Plan Marshall... All his work. 

 

Somehow I think that Ace might be the same, but on a smaller scale as he isn't the main antagonist; he is just an Agent. Their actions could stretch throughout the entire plot; they might've been the head one behind Grand Station bombing, I'd dare to say. They might manipulate and control "mere mortals" to do his bindings. As if right now, they don't have a clear motive... due to not even appearing or being directly mentioned as of V18. 

Yet... Somehow... I'm starting to feel that Ace has been controlling our actions, and everything was predicted by them, making Team Meteor get the upper hand most of the time. 

[Green Bean 501]

1 hour ago, Oscarus said:

Hey. Now I've noticed... 

Ace, despite appearing at the story's end, is said to "have such a presence like they've been there the whole time". 

Do you know what other major antagonist appeared basically at the end of the main plot, but in summary it was like they'd been in the story since the beginning? 

Steven Armstrong 

That also reminds me of Father Balder in Bayonetta

• Main antagonist
• Basically driving the entire plot from the start
• Only appears in Chapter 16 and the Epilogue 

This can't be a coincidence, right?

[Oscarus]

43 minutes ago, Green Bean 501 said:

That also reminds me of Father Balder in Bayonetta

Didn't play Bayonetta, so can't relate. 

But maybe you're right. 

 

I just hope that Ace won't be some throw-away antagonist just because, but all of this has some sort of connection. Otherwise, that'd be waste of a character. 

44 minutes ago, Green Bean 501 said:

This can't be a coincidence, right?

There are some "coincidences" in Reborn, like Titania VS Erza

• redhead
• swordfighter 
• blue-haired love interest 
• short-fused, at moments 
• young women
• Erza also is sometimes called "Titania", if I recall 

Tis a "coincidence", still. 

[The Swordsman]

On 3/20/2022 at 2:14 PM, Green Bean 501 said:

I'm pretty sure Reborn isn't being made with Rejuvenation's plot in mind, but I trust that the devs will figure out a way to make them compatible. Worst case scenario is that some of Reborn's sidequests might have to be considered "non canon" to Rejuvenation's timeline

Its not just the plot but the very setting itself thats different. As I have stated elsewhere, unlike Rejuvenation which is more a melting pot of the games, anime (which is wildly different from the games) and its own fully unique lore, Reborn so far has held itself true the games' canon and has tried to keep its additions with it in mind. While a version of the Reborn region and its characters can exist in Rejuvenation, it can't be the original due to this.

[pokemastercj1]

Alright with e19 in beta I'm just making sure I get in on the last hype thread.



S O O N : ))))))

 

 

That is all.

[Mr.Badass]

This maybe the last time I see you guys . See you on the other side, motherfuckers.

[HakuryuYukio]

One thing i'm looking forward to is how the whole "Lin shatters" prophecy is gonna play out.

Remember in Shades Gym,

 

Spoiler

we had the four Visions of Corey, Kiki, Amaria and Lin. Shade told the player in the WTC that only two of those visions would lead to death. Corey and Kiki died and Amaria survived her Fall leaving only Lin.

 

My guess is that her real body is sealed inside the castle below the grand gates alongside the Baby Arceus, Terra was talking about in the glitch world. The Body we have seen so far "shatters" once her real self is unsealed alongside the Baby Arceus which is definetly grown up by now (Lord help us all).

 

Also another theory: The actual Lin that is sealed is still a child. Perhaps she made a deal with Arceus where she requested power but as a sacrifice would always remain a child. The adult Lin we have encountered so far is just an "imagination" of what Child Lin believes herself to look like as an Adult.

 

Perhaps the Adult Lin is just a Facade to hide her own immaturity and the Body shattering will be the equivalent of the facade coming off.

 

Also when i think of this theory i'm always reminded of one of my favourite quotes from Cowboy Bebop:

"There is nothing more pure and cruel as a child".

 

[Oscarus]

25 minutes ago, HakuryuYukio said:

Spoiler

My guess is that her real body is sealed inside the castle below the grand gates alongside the Baby Arceus, Terra was talking about in the glitch world. The Body we have seen so far "shatters" once her real self is unsealed alongside the Baby Arceus which is definetly grown up by now (Lord help us all).

 

Also another theory: The actual Lin that is sealed is still a child. Perhaps she made a deal with Arceus where she requested power but as a sacrifice would always remain a child. The adult Lin we have encountered so far is just an "imagination" of what Child Lin believes herself to look like as an Adult.

 

Perhaps the Adult Lin is just a Facade to hide her own immaturity and the Body shattering will be the equivalent of the facade coming off.

 

Also when i think of this theory i'm always reminded of one of my favourite quotes from Cowboy Bebop:

"There is nothing more pure and cruel as a child".

 

Quote

And kids... are cruel. All people are, by nature. They just lose touch with it as they get older - start thinking they know right and wrong. 

"That's immoral!" 

"War crimes - this, Code of Conduct - that" 

Kids you can mold, manipulate into performing all kinds of atrocities, and there's nothing like a good atrocity to keep a war going. 

Despite this being... kinda terryfing, it's true. 

Kids aren't born evil - they have to be taught how to be evil. They absorb the knowledge like sponge water; and by that I mean all kinds of knowledge, even the most wrong.

The older human gets, and the longer they are affected, the harder it is to knock the sense into them. 

 

Still... I do wonder what kind of influence has affected Lin to be that nightmare'ish in that young age; the biological one, of course. Because I doubt that one or two series of electroshocks would be sufficient; they might have some negative effects, affecting the brain of the victim... but like that?! 

However... we do not know if those were applied before Lin was massively misbehaving. Because if kids were nice, Sigmund would have no reason to shock them (although he himself needs his own therapy to get over the loss of his dearest). Still, I don't say that's impossible... Yet very unlikely, and there has to be someone behind the curtain to mastermind it all. 

[HakuryuYukio]

9 minutes ago, Oscarus said:

Despite this being... kinda terryfing, it's true. 

Kids aren't born evil - they have to be taught how to be evil. They absorb the knowledge like sponge water; and by that I mean all kinds of knowledge, even the most wrong.

The older human gets, and the longer they are affected, the harder it is to knock the sense into them. 

 

Still... I do wonder what kind of influence has affected Lin to be that nightmare'ish in that young age; the biological one, of course. Because I doubt that one or two series of electroshocks would be sufficient; they might have some negative effects, affecting the brain of the victim... but like that?! 

However... we do not know if those were applied before Lin was massively misbehaving. Because if kids were nice, Sigmund would have no reason to shock them (although he himself needs his own therapy to get over the loss of his dearest). Still, I don't say that's impossible... Yet very unlikely, and there has to be someone behind the curtain to mastermind it all. 

Yeah, i guess we won't find out until we know her full story. Think about it, we don't even know what her life before the orphanage was like and that's the scary part. According to Laura, she already was this cruel when she arrived at the orphange. Really makes you wonder how f'ed up her childhood must have been before she meet Terra.

[Hamster Haze]

7 hours ago, HakuryuYukio said:

One thing i'm looking forward to is how the whole "Lin shatters" prophecy is gonna play out.

Remember in Shades Gym,

 

  Reveal hidden contents

we had the four Visions of Corey, Kiki, Amaria and Lin. Shade told the player in the WTC that only two of those visions would lead to death. Corey and Kiki died and Amaria survived her Fall leaving only Lin.

 

My guess is that her real body is sealed inside the castle below the grand gates alongside the Baby Arceus, Terra was talking about in the glitch world. The Body we have seen so far "shatters" once her real self is unsealed alongside the Baby Arceus which is definetly grown up by now (Lord help us all).

 

Also another theory: The actual Lin that is sealed is still a child. Perhaps she made a deal with Arceus where she requested power but as a sacrifice would always remain a child. The adult Lin we have encountered so far is just an "imagination" of what Child Lin believes herself to look like as an Adult.

 

Perhaps the Adult Lin is just a Facade to hide her own immaturity and the Body shattering will be the equivalent of the facade coming off.

 

Also when i think of this theory i'm always reminded of one of my favourite quotes from Cowboy Bebop:

"There is nothing more pure and cruel as a child".

 

Spoiler

I always thought Lin would accomplish her goal, and her shattering would be activating that thing she found in agate, whatever it may be. Remember that Shade's gym doesnt explicitly show deaths, when Amaria didnt end up dying

 

[HakuryuYukio]

6 hours ago, L__Haze said:

  Reveal hidden contents

I always thought Lin would accomplish her goal, and her shattering would be activating that thing she found in agate, whatever it may be. Remember that Shade's gym doesnt explicitly show deaths, when Amaria didnt end up dying

 

Lin actually accomplishing her goal would be quite interesting. Kind of like Kefka did in Final Fantasy 6.

Usually it's the same structure: protagnist prevents villain from achieving his goal. But what if we have to try a second time after failing to stop her the first time ?

[Shadow Angel]

On 3/22/2022 at 2:35 AM, Oscarus said:

Hey. Now I've noticed... 

Ace, despite appearing at the story's end, is said to "have such a presence like they've been there the whole time". 

Do you know what other major antagonist appeared basically at the end of the main plot, but in summary it was like they'd been in the story since the beginning? 

No, you’re getting Ace all wrong. What I read from the dev blog is that Ace is being added in the revisions to the existing story, and they will appear regularly starting from early game until some undefined point. I actually think Ace’s story may already be over by the time you get to the end of content currently in E18, as the devs said that players continuing into new E19 content need not concern themselves with Ace in order to understand the new story; this reads to me like Ace isn’t involved in the ending at all, or at most a minimal role that doesn’t change the plot. My sneaking suspicion is that they are killed off at some point pre-E19.

[CrystalStar]

2 hours ago, Shadow Angel said:

No, you’re getting Ace all wrong. What I read from the dev blog is that Ace is being added in the revisions to the existing story, and they will appear regularly starting from early game until some undefined point. I actually think Ace’s story may already be over by the time you get to the end of content currently in E18, as the devs said that players continuing into new E19 content need not concern themselves with Ace in order to understand the new story; this reads to me like Ace isn’t involved in the ending at all, or at most a minimal role that doesn’t change the plot. My sneaking suspicion is that they are killed off at some point pre-E19.

If this ends up being true I will be very sad, ace seems like such a fun character

[Oscarus]

9 minutes ago, CrystalStar said:

If this ends up being true I will be very sad, ace seems like such a fun character

 +1

 

My scenario seems to be more interesting - to have some new "antagonist" appear at the "end". Not exactly some final one, but at least unexpected and OP one

[HakuryuYukio]

Meh... not really a fan of that concept. It could work if properly executed like with Senator Armstrong in MGR, but the Reborn Cast is already so bloated that we really don't need another new character(minus Ace)

 

Plus, we already have enough villains as it stands: Lin, Solaris, Sirius, Dr. Sigmund and Elias. Shoehorning in another one would just be pushing it.

[Oscarus]

7 minutes ago, HakuryuYukio said:

Plus, we already have enough villains as it stands: Lin, Solaris, Sirius, Dr. Sigmund and Elias.

I'd argue to call some of them "villain"

They're antagonists, yes, but villains... not necessarily. 

Elias is definitely more of an antagonist, as his actions are anything BUT destruction and chaos; he simply wishes for Reborn to return to how it once was, and has his daughter (?) come back. His methods aren't the best ones (kidnapping and influencing the mind), but in comparison to likes of Titania and Saphira, he's an angel. 

Sigmund is another one; not as much, yet still. Electroshock therapy IS dangerous, especially when overused, but he wishes to do no harm. He might be mentally ill himself, after the death of his sister who committed suicide because she refused to be threated with electroshocks, which might have saved her, but he refuses to admit it, believing that the specific method is the best one. 

Solaris is a... mixed bag. While his actions are definitely unacceptable, his motives and intentions show that all of this can se said as "I don't want to, but I have to". Being a rebel in his younger age (even bigger than Taka), he was starting to regret his decisions as the years passed after his parents' murder. I'd say that basing of backstories, events and characters of all Reborn characters, Solaris had one of the hardest, if not the hardest, life to go through, which is powered by his "old by comparison" age (45+). However that doesn't completely justify some of his actions, like wanting to destroy Apophyll Academy. 

Lin and Sirius are remorseless blood-and-power-hungry monsters with no redeeming qualities that have to be eliminated. 

But if possible, I'd like to be Lin's friend, as long as she promises to behave 

[HakuryuYukio]

44 minutes ago, Oscarus said:

I'd argue to call some of them "villain"

They're antagonists, yes, but villains... not necessarily. 

Elias is definitely more of an antagonist, as his actions are anything BUT destruction and chaos; he simply wishes for Reborn to return to how it once was, and has his daughter (?) come back. His methods aren't the best ones (kidnapping and influencing the mind), but in comparison to likes of Titania and Saphira, he's an angel. 

Sigmund is another one; not as much, yet still. Electroshock therapy IS dangerous, especially when overused, but he wishes to do no harm. He might be mentally ill himself, after the death of his sister who committed suicide because she refused to be threated with electroshocks, which might have saved her, but he refuses to admit it, believing that the specific method is the best one. 

Solaris is a... mixed bag. While his actions are definitely unacceptable, his motives and intentions show that all of this can se said as "I don't want to, but I have to". Being a rebel in his younger age (even bigger than Taka), he was starting to regret his decisions as the years passed after his parents' murder. I'd say that basing of backstories, events and characters of all Reborn characters, Solaris had one of the hardest, if not the hardest, life to go through, which is powered by his "old by comparison" age (45+). However that doesn't completely justify some of his actions, like wanting to destroy Apophyll Academy. 

Lin and Sirius are remorseless blood-and-power-hungry monsters with no redeeming qualities that have to be eliminated. 

But if possible, I'd like to be Lin's friend, as long as she promises to behave 

while i can see your point with Solaris, i respectfully disagree when it comes to Sigmund and Elias.

 

First Sigmund: While i definetly feel sorry that he lost his sister which lead to some severe mental trauma, it still doesn't excuse him abducting children and performing shock therapy on them.

 

Next Elias: I actually have more respect for Titania and Saphira. Yes they definetly tend to go overboard, but in the end their hearts are in the right place because they want to protect their loved ones.

Elias on the other hand... oh boy where do i even start?

a) he tried to offer his "daughter" as a sacrifice to Arceus which is essentialy the sugarcoat version of killing her

b) pretty sure if Radomus and Gardevoir didn't intervene, the player and Cain would have suffered the same fate. Elias to me is just another one of those religious fanatics trying to justify his actions by claiming that he's acting "in the Name of the Lord" which is complete BS if you ask me.

[KingInfernal]

20 minutes ago, HakuryuYukio said:

a) he tried to offer his "daughter" as a sacrifice to Arceus which is essentialy the sugarcoat version of killing her

It's passed some time from the last time i played the game, but i remember that he was sacrifing Cain for purify his daughter.

 

Not that that make the situation any better, in fact i want that religious fanatic mindwasher to be killed by the Arc-Pulse even more.

Edited March 23, 2022 by KingInfernal

[Xerres]

Regarding Titania and Saphira, their actions are a response to what has happened. Maybe they're generally ruthless people, but they didn't just wake up and decide 'I'mma kill some people today.'

The city is under attack by terrorists who are killing indiscriminately to achieve their goals. Saphira killed members of a terrorist group that were in the process of abducting children to be tortured. Titania killed people intentionally poisoning the city's water supply.

They aren't villains, they frankly aren't even extreme. They're responding rationally to the existence of a child murdering terrorist cell. I don't care if the Meteors like each other and feel sad when they lose their friends. They killed everyone on that train, they killed an innocent girl and many others with the Tangrowth attack, they were going to wipe out the city with the Camerupt. They are actively trying to kill a city full of people.

Taka has killed more people than Titania, his Tangrowth is the one that killed the girl who was just sitting in her room. At least Titania looks people in the eye, gives them a fighting chance, and is only targeting the organization on a murder spree.

The idea that Titania and Saphira are in any way in the wrong is bizarre to me. Like saying that if the Manson Family burst into your house to kidnap your child sister, you're a monster if you shoot them, because they super like each other and will be sad now. Who cares how much they like each other? They're killing children, their free trial of being alive has now ended.

[Oscarus]

55 minutes ago, HakuryuYukio said:

it still doesn't excuse him abducting children and performing shock therapy on them.

Like I said, he might be mentally ill himself and not be aware of his actions. "Might" being the operative word here. 

57 minutes ago, HakuryuYukio said:

he tried to offer his "daughter" as a sacrifice to Arceus which is essentialy the sugarcoat version of killing her

Where? When? Is there a part that I've missed? 

If you mean that event I'm Subseven Sanctum, then he wanted to "cleanse her mind from the mind control of that swine Radomus". 

However I must agree with you on that one - believing cult leader isn't a good idea (anyone that played Insurgence will agree with me) 

59 minutes ago, HakuryuYukio said:

another one of those religious fanatics trying to justify his actions by claiming that he's acting "in the Name of the Lord" which is complete BS if you ask me.

Funny, because in the backstory of my Pokemon OC there were many of that kind in his father's court. That had far going consequences in the future in the next years, like... 

Actually, no, I shan't tell you about it. 

20 minutes ago, Xerres said:

I don't care if the Meteors like each other and feel sad when they lose their friends. They killed everyone on that train, they killed an innocent girl and many others with the Tangrowth attack, they were going to wipe out the city with the Camerupt. They are actively trying to kill a city full of people.

Y-yeah, but some of them constantly disagree with that, even outright refuse to follow orders that will cause the death of innocents. Problem? They don't have a choice but to follow. If Solaris was the sole leader, not only the number of casualties would be lower (not necessarily "zero", but definitely less), but I think he could accept his allies' choice of resignation. But the others? We've seen what were the consequences of "betrayal" first eye, and that can be applied to any member - from mere Grunt to Agent; the number of "saves" you could count using fingers of your hand. 

Team Meteor, regardless of what it was or intended to be, is a terroristic and threatsome organization that is needed to be disbanded and shutted down immediately. But most of them have to be spared - they will end up in prisons or at least do community services involuntarily, however them don't deserve to die just because they wanted a better life, and unconsciously became allied with a terrorists without ability to go back

 

And that comes from a guy which character, by the time of Pokemon Reborn events, has killed more people than the entire Team Meteor individually and collectively combined 

[HakuryuYukio]

12 minutes ago, Oscarus said:

Y-yeah, but some of them constantly disagree with that, even outright refuse to follow orders that will cause the death of innocents. Problem? They don't have a choice but to follow. If Solaris was the sole leader, not only the number of casualties would be lower (not necessarily "zero", but definitely less), but I think he could accept his allies' choice of resignation. But the others? We've seen what were the consequences of "betrayal" first eye, and that can be applied to any member - from mere Grunt to Agent; the number of "saves" you could count using fingers of your hand. 

Team Meteor, regardless of what it was or intended to be, is a terroristic and threatsome organization that is needed to be disbanded and shutted down immediately. But most of them have to be spared - they will end up in prisons or at least do community services involuntarily, however them don't deserve to die just because they wanted a better life, and unconsciously became allied with a terrorists without ability to go back

 

And that comes from a guy which character, by the time of Pokemon Reborn events, has killed more people than the entire Team Meteor individually and collectively combined 

Doesn't change the fact that they are still part of a terrorist group. Nobody forced those grunts to join team Meteor. Once you join a group like that, your intentions don't mean a damn thing. You're actively taking part in a group that murders innocent people because they want to force their believes upon the world.

 

It's called "guilty by association" for a reason.