spark95 Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 Could you please give us a little more options with our responses? For example, when we're caged in by Nuzleaf and Fern offers to release us if we beg, instead of a plain "No", say "Go to hell." I can't remember all of the scenes where we have a say in something, but plain "Yes" and "No" seem a little too simplistic. Every single character in Reborn is incredibly developed except us, the protagonist. I know it may deviate from how Pokemon games usually are, but "our" vocabulary in that game is literally worse than Link in LoZ. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Combat Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 While it is true our characters feel a little blend, I think it's up to the player to create the story for themselves. With little backstory given to us, we are aloud to create our own story. Of course, I'd like to say that to Fern just as much as the next guy, but as a silent protagonist, you can only go so far. (Also, I'm pretty new here, but would you want to mark this as a spoiler since your mentioning plot details?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spark95 Posted September 10, 2015 Author Share Posted September 10, 2015 (edited) While it is true our characters feel a little blend, I think it's up to the player to create the story for themselves. With little backstory given to us, we are aloud to create our own story. Of course, I'd like to say that to Fern just as much as the next guy, but as a silent protagonist, you can only go so far. (Also, I'm pretty new here, but would you want to mark this as a spoiler since your mentioning plot details?) I agree, but I think there are a lot of situations, where simple answers aren't adequate. In LoZ Skyward Sword, the game occasionally allows you to choose between 3 answers, and each answer provokes a different response from NPCs. What I don't like is.. Fern: Get on your knees and beg. Me: Yes. Fern: Haha, great. Now repeat after me, "I am an inferior trainer to Fern and always will be" Me: No Fern: What? So you won't do it? Fine. There's so little emotion that the NPC's emotion seems almost unwarranted. As for the spoiler tag, I believe only episode 16 spoilers need it? Edited September 10, 2015 by spark95 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tacos Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 As for the spoilers, the lock has been lifted since July, so you're fine. Also 16 isn't out so if you for some reason have spoiler's, we'd have to kill you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vinny Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 While I can see your point, you have to remember that Ame wants to keep Reborn as canon to a real pokémon game as possible. And usually, pokémon games don't have answers different from "Yes or No". Maybe in Gen VI, but that's a very recent tweak. And even then, do keep in mind that Ame's first and foremost goal is to finish the game. Even with some different answers, the outcome on the end would still be the same. So, for now, let's keep the focus on finishing the game first. Although, if Ame thinks this might be a good idea, it will probably fall into "tweaks that she might" do AFTER the game is finished. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Global Mods Ice Cream Sand Witch Posted September 10, 2015 Global Mods Share Posted September 10, 2015 I hope there's a question like the kid in Pacifidlog Town that asks "Where are you from?" and the answers are yes and no. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spark95 Posted September 10, 2015 Author Share Posted September 10, 2015 I hope there's a question like the kid in Pacifidlog Town that asks "Where are you from?" and the answers are yes and no. Actually, couldn't they do that with the Fern scene I described? You would say yes, and then Fern would leave you without opening the door because you merely said yes instead of repeating the sentence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deleted User Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 Well for one, that'd take up more of the screen with the dialog box, but It might be a cool idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mde2001 Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 There are options to change the answers but I agree that yes and no are better and allow you to develop your own character. I personally wouldn't say go to hell, so wouldn't love that to be an option. And Combat Medic, spoilers are only required for the newest episode's content for a short period of time (referred to as the spoiler lock). The Nuzleaf cage occurs in E3 so has been out for several years so does not require a spoiler ever again (currently there is no spoiler lock at all so you can post anything freely). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelazi5 Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 Personally with me the trainer almost always ends up being a blank slate/vehicle/puppet for my pokemon team's adventures. Usually my starter ends up as the main character with the team acting more like a roving band of pokemon adventurers fighting evil and stuff. I've never been good at projecting myself or much of any character into silent protagonists. But who knows, it could change since my answers to the interview questions in Alpha Sapphire turned my guy into a disgusting memelord/generic anime shonen protag. I just think we need a bit more to work with. Honestly I think it'd be cool if we had an interview feature or something similar to the ORAS ones, it would give us a bit more to work with for us personality wise. Or have options to type in our own responses to questions. For the next Gen VI Kalos game, which I'm assuming is coming out next year, I plan on basing my character on the one I chose in Reborn, to act as a prequel of sorts. My only grip is that we were forced to read Titania's diary and was annoyed when I found that was the only possible way to advance the story. It felt like we were a bit too railroaded at that point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foamy Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 "I'll gladly bail you out... if you get on your knees and beg. Whaddya say?">No>Hell no Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerogatoryTrainer Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 The only problem I've had so far with this is this cage is super easy to escape from without outside help Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mde2001 Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 The only problem I've had so far with this is this cage is super easy to escape from without outside help Are you referring to the Chatot here or have you found a different way out of the cage? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaunt Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 Are you referring to the Chatot here or have you found a different way out of the cage? not that, if you think about it that cage is flimsy (at best) and your Pokemon have moves to break something like that easily (cut for example) not to mention fire moves. P.S. Almost forgot my opinion on the topic: it would be cool yes but Ame has already a ton of work for e16 so maybe later? It is not a "critical" improvement so it can wait imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerogatoryTrainer Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 Are you referring to the Chatot here or have you found a different way out of the cage? Gaunt answered it for me. And how come there are no Fire Element HMs anyway? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragon116 Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 I think Earthquake should be a HM if we go down that road. Think about all the cave shifting you could do if EQ was an HM. Fire element HM....maybe Ember? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edea Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 I think Earthquake should be a HM if we go down that road. Think about all the cave shifting you could do if EQ was an HM. Fire element HM....maybe Ember? Wouldn't that be a bit hard on the "programming side"? I mean, it's like dishing out a new "event" with a new "obstacle" that has to be created for the new HM to be used. Also we are a silent protagonist. I think that giving more answers than "Yes" or "No" wouldn't fit very well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragon116 Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 It would be difficult, and that's why they would never do it. But if they were to add a new HM, EQ would be awesome. That's my only point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurotsune Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 Add new dialogue options? > Yes No Add new dialogue options? Yes > No Add new dialogue options? > Yes No Add new dialogue options? Yes > No Add new dialogue options? > Yes No Add new dialogue options? Yes > No Yep. It's no. Sorry, took me a bit to decide. Too many choices. The problems with your request are the core assumptions you make in regards of this system. The silent yes/no protagonsit is a tool of immersion, not a detriment to it. The main character's development is left alone so that the player can decide themselves how they develop. What would you do in this situation? Do you agree? How would you reply? If we were to add "Yes/No/Hell No" to the Fern debacle, we're adding a personality to this silent protagonist, and at the moment we do that, we may as well add full dialogue to that character. Why? Because by making choice non-generalized, by specifying choice, we're determining personality. Unless an option for every single possible response is added, we'd be determining and limiting character personality to whatever plethora of options made avaiable. You'd no longer be able to deviate from the norm. Instead of being able to have whatever character personality you'd like by using your imagination, instead, you're given a mold. "In this situation, Ari would plead for her life and Vero wouldn't. If you're not doing that, you're not following canon". We don't want that. We don't want to give you a mold or a personality to follow, but instead, allow you to fill you in the gaps within your imagination. Your character isn't developing? Well, what were your first impressions of Reborn? How have they changed as the game progressed? That's your development right there. At the moment we add "character development", we're adding "character". At that moment, reborn is no longer about you and your journey through the region, but rather about Vero/Kuro/Alice/Lucia/Ari/Decibel's journey, and you stop being the protagonist to instead being a bystander, watching from the sidelines and working solely as a tool to further the plot, and not the guiding force behind it. And yes some games are like that and some games like that are very good, but this one isn't. Adding that functionality to reborn would kill it's essence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veterans Azeria Posted September 10, 2015 Veterans Share Posted September 10, 2015 TBH if more text options would be possible.... Every possible insult in the book would be thrown at Fern and Blake.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragon116 Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 Don't forget Solaris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commander Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 I think Earthquake should be a HM if we go down that road. Think about all the cave shifting you could do if EQ was an HM. Fire element HM....maybe Ember? Honestly, I'd rather push away from HMs then to make more of them, but that's honestly just me. I mean there are other ways to create puzzles such as key items and scripting in which you wouldn't have to force a move on a Pokemon. __________________________________________________ Now for the whole choice option things. Begrudgingly, I have to agree with Kuro on all xyr points. The whole silent protagonist thing is something I could make for a huge debate, but it is a tool of immersion no matter how effective or not it is. Giving personality to the protagonist with those choices would "take away" from that supposed personality. So it is best to leave it as the yes or no options. I suppose it would be possible to edit those choices and texts rather easily and alter the dialogue a bit for Hardcore if someone put it up for suggestions. The mod is a bit different as most people would've already played the game and would probably prefer having the option to be a complete dick to Fern and other different choices because they already made their choice once. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Global Mods Ice Cream Sand Witch Posted September 10, 2015 Global Mods Share Posted September 10, 2015 (edited) I agree about the silent protagonist being one you can implant yourself into, but someone else brought up the diary scene, which is one of the reasons I can't implant myself regardless. If I saw Titania's diary there, I would've just left it alone. I respect the privacy of others and I wouldn't be interested in its contents in the first place. Edited September 10, 2015 by Ice Cream Sand Witch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joost Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 TBH if more text options would be possible.... Every possible insult in the book would be thrown at Fern and Blake.... They do deserve it tho, assholes that they are, not only in the dialogue but if you don't have a fire type fern's Ferroseed/Ferrothorn will absolutely wreck you with curse,gyro ball and power whip/pin missle. and i will never forgive him for the 2 times he sweeped out my main 6 pokemon in the nuzlockes i did!, Also the boss fight agains Fern and Blake is really freaking hard, since Florinia has only grass types (and 1 ground type) so Blake destroyes her and you are left to fight both of them on your own. (sorry for bad english, I am Dutch) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spark95 Posted September 10, 2015 Author Share Posted September 10, 2015 Okay, so I can see why many would be against adding character to the protagonists side. But, is it possible to add emotion to the answers, without thrusting the character part onto it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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