Ojama Yellow

neither is just about any eeveelution cuz theyre all just literally eevee with a small stupid gimmick attached to them wait who said that

Nihilego: 20 Buzzwole: 16 Pheromosa: 21 Xurkitree: 19 Celesteela: 15 Kartana: 21 Guzzlord: 18 Poipole: 20 Naganadel: 20 Stakataka: 21 Blacephalon: 16

I dont really feel too strongly towards most pseudos, but some are still better than others. Dragonite: 20 Tyranitar: 20 Salamence: 17 Metagross: 19 Garchomp: 21 Hydreigon: 20 Goodra: 20 Kommo-o: 20

> glaceon wins > bulbasaur dies what the fuck IS IT WITH YOU PEOPLE TODAY Totodile: 4 Piplup: 13 Chespin: 7

Mew: 8 Jirachi: 3 Manaphy: 5

current standings Espeon: 9 Glaceon : 5 Sylveon: 5 broskis, its just a small, light-hearted game with barely to no actual rules. basically a glorified 'favorite of the community' in a way. no need to start this entire thing over. nobody ruined anyones game- this is the way its designed to be played. the intention is there, but im rather sure that the second rule is going to be difficult if not impossible to enforce.

god fucking christened dammit I fucking told you not to kill vaporeon before glaceon and yet you did I swear to god cant I leave you bunch alone for like five fucking minutes

to my surprise, there is very little salt going on in that thread, barring a guy calling someone else lowkey dumb for proposing to delete the baton pass clause overall, and allow unlimited baton pass. anyway, the main thing of that thread is the following. "The OU Council believes that Baton Pass, as a move, should be banned from the SM OU metagame. Despite having a clause implemented to hinder Baton Pass teams, there are clearly still effective teams that make use of this strategy. Baton Pass teams are one of the most controversial parts of the metagame currently and this is in large part due to the strategy behind them, passing stat boosts to threatening Pokemon that can take advantage of them without many drawbacks. Common abusers of this strategy, such as Necrozma, Magearna, and Espeon, take advantage of being passed Speed boosts from Scolipede and then set up on their own, proceeding to sweep through a significant portion of the metagame and teams that are used. Therefore, the OU council believes that these teams have no place in the SM OU metagame and we must do something to change this." the reason they didnt ban espeon + magic bounce is apparently partly because it wasnt the main problem at the moment, and partly because smogon has attempted complex bans for baton pass before and the move still managed to be broken. the first clause reportedly was to limit three baton passers on each team, which didnt go too well. after that, it was limited to only one baton passer a team, but apparently iron defense scolipede and geomancy smeargle still kicked asses during that era. the next ban was 'limit to one baton passer a team and disallow baton passing speed alongside other boosts'. from what ive read, some pokemon in the sm ou metagame (especially necrozma and magearna) were able to take those speed passes, and wreck the majority of the metagame without too much trouble. so passing speed + other stats with baton pass had already been considered and banned- but apparently that wasnt enough. the next possibility would be to just ban baton pass in combination with any speed raising move, or just disallow baton pass to pass on boosts overall. the reason the council voted to ban baton pass rather than allow either one of these was that the clause would get overly complicated. the first mentioned possibility, namely baton pass + stats other than speed, would end up in a banlist so overly complicated that they felt it was a better idea to just outright ban the move, rather than compile a list of 50+ moves, abilities...etc. that baton pass couldnt be used with. the latter...the comparison to speed boost + blaziken and double team vs bright powder got brought up. overall it was decided that barely anything would be hurt from the loss of drypassing, and that it wasnt worth implementing a clause for. especially because the clause would be, once again, extremely convoluted. keep in mind that the majority of this information isnt me speaking- rather its shortened version of the thoughts of the council while discussing the baton pass ban. I am in no way knowledgeable enough to come up with all this myself (especially considering ive barely done any competitive in gen VII). also, im pretty confusion hasnt been banned outright- the one getting the boot was swagger due to the move being extremely uncompetitive. either way, should you feel like continuing this discussion, my pm box is open. I feel like this thread has been the plaything of this baton pass discussion for long enough now.

I wasnt entirely wrong, but apparently theres a whole backstory to the baton pass and smogon tale that goes way past chainpassing. which can be read here. theres a whole lot of discussion that went on that barely even looked at chainpassing, but as you can see disagreements still happened. roar was impossible because espeons magic bounce...well, bounced that back. a fast taunter would be able to shut the strategy down early on, provided they didnt baton pass to espeon before or something. outspeeding was definitely hard because the most important stat to pass is usually speed. prankster taunters like sableye, klefki and whimsicott are pretty much the only viable taunters to shut the strategy down, and even of that list only sableye would be able to hit espeon hard.

if I recall correctly, a big reason why baton pass got banned was that baton pass chain teams existed. you couldnt whirlwind, roar, toxic or taunt them, because they would just baton pass into espeon, who bounced back whatever you tried to give them. haze is an extremely situational move that usually requires giving up a moveslot for something more suited to the mons role. unless your name is fucking toxapex in which case please get out of my life.

not gonna lie, the will-o-wisp mew set was definitely my favorite. though I used to run something really weird. iirc it was wisp, taunt, rocks and roost. it was a fun one, albeit reliant on your opponent not knowing what tf that mew is running.

in my case, I voted for mew continuously because I like its versatility. I dont particularly find it very cute, though. Mew: 14 Jirachi: 3 Manaphy: 9 Victini: 5 on the topic of jirachi-

mfw my favorite two starters almost made it to the top five but then mudkip got eliminated. sad life. at the very least I dont dislike any of the mons remaining so thats already a plus. Bulbasaur: 11 Cyndaquil: 11 Totodile: 9 Piplup: 10 Chespin : 15

I swear to god if vaporeon dies before glaceon yall are gonna have a bad time Vaporeon: 5 Espeon: 8 Glaceon: 7 Sylveon: 13

11-2=10 uh. Vaporeon: 8 Espeon: 13 Leafeon: 11 Glaceon: 9 Sylveon: 12 actual standings.

Vaporeon: 10 Umbreon: 4 Espeon: 13 Leafeon: 11 Glaceon: 9 Sylveon: 11

Mew: 12 Celebi: 6 Jirachi: 14 Manaphy: 11 Victini: 7

Bulbasaur: 13 Cyndaquil: 13 Totodile: 15 Mudkip: 4 Piplup: 12 Chespin: 10 Rowlet: 10 Popplio: 8

nothing at all. good job being accurate. if I keep summoning spine, I bet I will succeed one day.