Something Awful LP of Pokemon Reborn

[Alilatias]

So while taking a stroll through the SA LP forum, I noticed that a LP of this fangame was submitted today.

 

https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3822012&userid=0&perpage=40&pagenumber=1

 

Right off the bat though, the LPer has taken an incredibly negative and perhaps overly pessimistic tone towards this game. It is slightly concerning because it seems a bit unjustified and overblown (there's already an argument in the thread where people have somehow interpreted the waterfall scene as being anti-LGBT for one), BUT I'm going to jump ahead and say that the bulldozing over the writing shouldn't really be what this thread here is about.

 

I find that maybe watching this LP could present a good opportunity to take some suggestions from beyond these forums to improve this game in the future. Though I might be getting ahead of myself here considering the LP hasn't even properly started yet.

Edited May 30, 2017 by Alilatias

[FairFamily]

Well if your site is something awfull and its title is internet makes you sttupid. I'm not surprised for a negative and pessimistic review.

[Alilatias]

46 minutes ago, FairFamily said:

Well if your site is something awfull and its title is internet makes you sttupid. I'm not surprised for a negative and pessimistic review.

 

To be fair, that site's name and subtitle are sort of a tongue-in-cheek joke. The website in general is mostly known for their higher quality LP's, and also tend to be very harshly critical, generally for very good reason in many cases.

 

I should mention that due to the nature of the site (having to pay for a membership and ad blocking + super high traffic overall, the Reborn LP over there already has 5k views, and this is only day 1), about every month or two, forum access is restricted to those who don't have a membership there (which includes me, so I won't be able to update this thread myself if anything interesting enough to be brought up here happens in the meantime), so don't be surprised if you check back on the LP at times only to find the thread inaccessible. Such guest restrictions tend to last for upwards of 2 weeks at a time.

Edited May 30, 2017 by Alilatias

[Wolfox]

I believe the reason there's negativity on the waterfall scene is because the chance of the LPers there knowing the backstory of the event is not the biggest. just speculating but I believe the critisism for it will most likely be due to things like that, where inside knowledge makes the inpact either bigger or smaller

[dead account]

Can't really say I blame them for not liking Cain. I certainly wasn't fond of him just suddenly hitting on me and shit. Made every scene with him very awkward for me.

 

I'm not sure if the guy doing the LP deliberately cherry picked the most "grimderp" looking starter shiny to make the game seem worse than it is about shinies or if they just randomly went with Snivy. Either way, you can tell a lot of the goons aren't just blindly hopping on a bandwagon in regards to bashing the game because most of them are actually praising the starter shinies. Especially Teenage Mutant Ninja Squirtle and Autumn Turtwig. So yeah, they're being cynical and critical, but hardly unfair. I'd personally say the complaint of the overuse of black on the starters shinies is a pretty valid one that would also extend to the rest of the pokemon in the game. A number of Reborn's shinies can be very unnecessarily "edgy" looking. The Wurmple-Dustox line is probably the best example. Because it's an entire evo line whose colour scheme is basically what would happen if you let a kid who's obsessed with Shadow the Edgehog recolour a pokemon.

 

Also, another major thing to note about Something Awful is its profanity filter. It will replace curse words with certain other phrases. This can be quite confusing to anyone unfamiliar with the site reading the LP, seeing odd phrases/words being tossed around like "gently caress" in place of "fuck", "loving" in place of "fucking", and "doo doo" in place of "shit". I'm sure you can find a full list somewhere.

[Alilatias]

I do find it hilarious though that many people in that thread are voting for a shiny Protean Froakie under the assumption that it'll break the game in half.

 

To those coming over from the LP that have noticed this thread's existence: It won't. Froakie is actually one of the weakest starters until halfway through the game when you start getting better TMs and are able to breed key moves onto it. If you really want to break the game in half, you'll be going for Speed Boost Torchic who is broken throughout the entire game (plus the fact that it's an early game Fire and Fighting type, of which options for both types are severely lacking until late in the game).

[ZEL]

Quote

I find that maybe watching this LP could present a good opportunity to take some suggestions from beyond these forums to improve this game in the future.

Oh, the dev team does actually look at commentary on the game outside of this forum, so it's not like criticism and suggestions for improvement are only noticed if they're posted on-site. Considering the game's been around for a while and been discussed in many places, there's been a fair few opportunities to read up on less flattering commentary (including a number of 4chan threads, naturally).

 

 

As of now, from glancing over the thread, it'd seem like most of what's been said/criticized is the same stuff that's been discussed and acknowledged many times in the past already. Issues like map/sprite design, shiny designs ranging from great to "black/gray again?", and clumsy storytelling are common complaints people have with the game, so I'm not surprised to see them pop up in a LP thread. There's bound to be a bunch of people who haven't played the game before and/or been active in our community, so what's 'old' complaints to users here is new material to discuss for them.

 

It's easy to be miffed at people for not being 'nice' about criticizing something one likes, but I wouldn't dismiss it on that principle.

I may check up on the LP in a bit when there's more content, though I'll have to admit for now I'm not really sold on the writing style. I just really like seeing what people have to say about moments in the game that i hated or loved. It's fun.

[V for Vendetta]

goes to SA LP

gets triggered

 

but in all seriousness Im not sure if this website is basically a 24/7 april fools day or not, it annoyed me at first but i got used to it and kept reading.But yeah i guess good fan games arent their cup of tea i guess.

[Commander]

Pretty sure Amethyst and I share a similar ideal when it comes to this as people have a right to hate the game. The guy brought up valid points, but there is no point getting upset about it. I've seen a few lps written like that for games, but this one did give me a good laugh. I should really find that xenogears lps.

 

As for this, getting upset is not going to help anyone and at best make the community look like a bunch fanboys crying out to something they don't want to hear. For me personally I prefer reading this over people who say a game is the best thing ever or perfect. That is just me.

 

Also this is tame compared to complaints I have had to handle.

[Jess]

Looks like their LP is purposedly edgy and whining about everything to get more clicks. If they hated it THAT much, why do a detailed let's play of it and burn their brain cells by doing something they hate? The criticism about stuff that can be improved (e.g. that skipping occasional line of dialogue that makes me read "something something..." before the actual text), some (very few) dull shinies/sprites and the map, which could be better (the first days I played reborn I honestly struggled to read the map, but it gets fine the more you get used to it. Still not very appealing/clear though), can be considered as positives from harsh criticism.

 

I feel like "something awful" is for Reborn what Gordon Ramsay is for food. An extremely harsh judge who whines too much to get publicity, but occasionally throws in some good advice!

 

Edit: Notice that many people complimented some custom starter pokemon shiny sprites as amazing.

Edited May 31, 2017 by Jess

[Wolfox]

well @Commander, the game isn't perfect, but no game is. my big flaw with it is that I usually get lost but that's my own issue (sence of direction of a baked potatoe), outside of that sometimes some of the battles are a little unfair (just wait till they get to the home invasion, that will probably make them hate the game), but those things are what give reborn it's charm if you ask me. "perfection is but an illusion you put up for yourself to complain about not being good enough"

[Jess]

2 hours ago, Wolfox Glace said:

some of the battles are a little unfair

That's why we all love Reborn though!  

2 hours ago, Wolfox Glace said:

(just wait till they get to the home invasion, that will probably make them hate the game)

They won't even get there if they genuinely hate it,lol.

I'm in anticipation of the whining about Julia's OP Sonicbooms, while they try to solo beat her with their OP Protean Frogadier! These noob kids think that Hidden abilities so early break the game... Little they know...

[Wolfox]

14 minutes ago, Jess said:

I'm in anticipation of the whining about Julia's OP Sonicbooms, while they try to solo beat her with their OP Protean Frogadier! These noob kids think that Hidden abilities so early break the game... Little they know...

indeed, or fern with his supiriority complex

[YinYang9705]

 

32 minutes ago, Jess said:

They won't even get there if they genuinely hate it,lol.

you'd be shocked on how many lps goons have finished on spite alone

[Jess]

40 minutes ago, YinYang9705 said:

 

you'd be shocked on how many lps goons have finished on spite alone

Then, it is just their policy to draw attention! Film critics have based their careers on hating everything, what would stop them from doing the same for games?

[TwinAero]

Wouldn't it be much simpler to have a regular LPer critic the game than to rely on this and have to wade through heaps upon heaps of random nitpicking to find a fair point that the game can be improved on?

[Alilatias]

So they've gone up to Julia now.

 

We're probably just too used to Reborn now and don't remember much about what it was like to have a blind run through the game, but I kind of get the impression that a lot of things are flying over the observers' heads. Or their expectations of early game Pokemon are a bit too high. Although that kind of viewpoint is fine, I guess. Reborn's just... Different.

[Ntfth]

6 hours ago, Alilatias said:

So they've gone up to Julia now.

 

We're probably just too used to Reborn now and don't remember much about what it was like to have a blind run through the game, but I kind of get the impression that a lot of things are flying over the observers' heads. Or their expectations of early game Pokemon are a bit too high. Although that kind of viewpoint is fine, I guess. Reborn's just... Different.

 

Honestly their complaints from that come across as kind of extremely petty. "You mean I have to use Abilities that grant immunity instead of just throwing out ground types or ghosts? What garbage!"

 

[Alilatias]

If there's one thing that's REALLY rubbing me the wrong way with the LP, it's that they've already convinced themselves that the writing is on the same tier as My Immortal. And everyone knows how bad that is.

 

The gameplay criticisms are at least somewhat valid in comparison. But the above is really overblown exaggeration.

[ProjectIceman]

What exactly makes a good Pokemon game? Is it following the formula of the original? Is it being completely original in both story line and battling? Personally, I like both the original games and most of the fangames (I wouldn't be here if I wasn't lol). 

 

The things I like about Pokemon Reborn is it's originality. The story was made for an older demographic rather than for the age group that Pokemon caters to (not bothered by it though). Most people may not like it compared to the original because of its difficulty, dark story, gigantic mapping, field effects, and many other things. 

 

I also like this game because over the years, the original games of Pokemon have gotten way too easy (especially since Pokemon XY). The EXP Share works on all of your Pokemon at once and the amount each Pokemon gets is much larger than it used to be. Your rivals tend to choose the Pokemon that is weak against the protagonist instead of being the snobbish rival who chooses your weakness on purpose. 

 

I am sure that most critics would not like how difficult this game is. It may feel like playing a nuzlocke (and I had my share of nightmares playing that mode of game). They also may not like that the story goes into topics that are deemed too dark, negative, sometimes even taboo to talk about in public. 

 

Well, all I have to say about this person after reading his review on the forum is "How Cheeky"

XD

[Jess]

16 hours ago, ProjectIceman said:

The things I like about Pokemon Reborn is it's originality.

I totally agree with you... But they just judge harshly things cause they are not what they are used to. For example, one comment says the following:

 

One thing I noticed is that, out of the 37 wild Pokemon available this early on, they're almost all extremely weak Pokemon lines rather than stuff you actually want to use (Noibat at least evolves into the fastest dragon type in the game, and Blitzle is usable). And deliberately going out of the way to make it impossible for you to have a ground type unless you traded one in from online or picked Mudkip and evolved it until after you've beaten the first (electric-type) gym is nothing but absurdity.

Also, slamming right into a full team of 6 on the first gym leader is beyond rude, even ignoring the terrain bullshit at work. Pokemon games never have more than 5 Pokemon on a gym leader (until post-game rematches); even the Elite Four tops out at 5 until post-game rematches. Having a major trainer with 6 Pokemon is usually reserved only for the Champion in modern Pokemon games.

 

A translation of this is... "WAH WAH WAH I CAN'T USE MY OU MONS SINCE THE BEGINNING, I CAN'T ABUSE GYM WEAKNESSES CUZ NO GROUND, I CAN'T HAVE ADVANTAGE IN NUMBERS CUZ GYM LEADER HAS 6 MONS OMG OP RIOT PLZ NERF THIS SHIT BROKEN CHAMP."

I thought useful feedback could come by this thread about actual disadvantages. I hadn't thought that they were actually a bunch of 5-year-olds whining cause they don't wanna use their brain to win a game.

[ProjectIceman]

1 hour ago, Jess said:

I hadn't thought that they were actually a bunch of 5-year-olds whining cause they don't wanna use their brain to win a game.

 

And you would know about using your brain to win a game. After all, you beat Charlotte with a mono-bug team lol. I still have problems beating Charlotte on a regular basis XD

[DerogatoryTrainer]

1 hour ago, Jess said:

I totally agree with you... But they just judge harshly things cause they are not what they are used to. For example, one comment says the following:

 

One thing I noticed is that, out of the 37 wild Pokemon available this early on, they're almost all extremely weak Pokemon lines rather than stuff you actually want to use (Noibat at least evolves into the fastest dragon type in the game, and Blitzle is usable). And deliberately going out of the way to make it impossible for you to have a ground type unless you traded one in from online or picked Mudkip and evolved it until after you've beaten the first (electric-type) gym is nothing but absurdity.

Also, slamming right into a full team of 6 on the first gym leader is beyond rude, even ignoring the terrain bullshit at work. Pokemon games never have more than 5 Pokemon on a gym leader (until post-game rematches); even the Elite Four tops out at 5 until post-game rematches. Having a major trainer with 6 Pokemon is usually reserved only for the Champion in modern Pokemon games.

 

A translation of this is... "WAH WAH WAH I CAN'T USE MY OU MONS SINCE THE BEGINNING, I CAN'T ABUSE GYM WEAKNESSES CUZ NO GROUND, I CAN'T HAVE ADVANTAGE IN NUMBERS CUZ GYM LEADER HAS 6 MONS OMG OP RIOT PLZ NERF THIS SHIT BROKEN CHAMP."

I thought useful feedback could come by this thread about actual disadvantages. I hadn't thought that they were actually a bunch of 5-year-olds whining cause they don't wanna use their brain to win a game.

 

What a god damn baby. Did he expect free Gibles outside the Gym or something?

[Jess]

29 minutes ago, ProjectIceman said:

 

And you would know about using your brain to win a game. After all, you beat Charlotte with a mono-bug team lol. I still have problems beating Charlotte on a regular basis XD

LOL, and seeing your videos on Youtube, your relaxed disposition leads me to the conclusion that you'd not be the one who'd whine about a difficult game, that offers you however a ton of possibilities to actually defeat it! I bet those kids have never even considered how doing a monorun is possible, even with psychics in pokemon yellow! They'd whine about how OP is a Bug-catcher's Butterfree in Viridian Forest or something...

 

Edit: @DerogatoryTrainer Nah, Gibles are too weak, and evolve too late in game. A Landorus-T would be their optimal choice.

Edited June 13, 2017 by Jess

[Hycrox]

26 minutes ago, Jess said:

LOL, and seeing your videos on Youtube, your relaxed disposition leads me to the conclusion that you'd not be the one who'd whine about a difficult game, that offers you however a ton of possibilities to actually defeat it! I bet those kids have never even considered how doing a monorun is possible, even with psychics in pokemon yellow! They'd whine about how OP is a Bug-catcher's Butterfree in Viridian Forest or something...

 

Edit: @DerogatoryTrainer Nah, Gibles are too weak, and evolve too late in game. A Landorus-T would be their optimal choice.

Hell, wynaut a fucken lvl 100 Arceus with all the plates right from the beginning?

 

Also are those guys just strongly against all fanmade gen 3 sprites for some reason? Seems so

Edited June 13, 2017 by Hycrox