"The Axe"

[Diana]

Now, excuse me if it's been said- but I think Deino could be fit in early game, or maybe mid game.. Why? Because it doesn't reach Hydreigon until a whopping level 65. If you have the dedication to stick with it for THAT long, congrats, you own a fairy magnet now. It IS extremely powerful, but it's something to think about- it'll be stuck as a Zweilous for a huge chunk of the current release, right?

[Sapp]

Now, excuse me if it's been said- but I think Deino could be fit in early game, or maybe mid game.. Why? Because it doesn't reach Hydreigon until a whopping level 65. If you have the dedication to stick with it for THAT long, congrats, you own a fairy magnet now. It IS extremely powerful, but it's something to think about- it'll be stuck as a Zweilous for a huge chunk of the current release, right?

Have to add Larvesta then also.

[fireheart4560]

I feel like the options are very limited early on.

Um, adding some weaker starters early on seems fair. Bulbasaur, chikarita

[Alilatias]

Ralts is insane with ORAS level-up now though. I would know because shortly after the release of Episode 14, I took advantage of the trading thread at the time to bring a Ralts onto a new save file. Ralts has like no problems in the early game + reaches final stage ridiculously early too. Ralts is fine where it is.

Oh, I think having a Larvesta available at Pyorous Mountain is warranted, considering you have to train it all the way to Lv. 59 in order for it to evolve, and I'd imagine leveling it is just pure hell up until then. Also makes sense considering Volcarona are expected to be found around volcanoes. Maybe make a new event where you have to fight a Lv. 65 Volcarona for possession of the egg, replacing the Heatmor event in some fashion.

Heatmor could probably be made available after Shelly, as a trade. Maybe for a Cherrim.

[Sapp]

I feel like the options are very limited early on.

Um, adding some weaker starters early on seems fair. Bulbasaur, chikarita

Maybe an incentive system so people would have a reason to pick Chikorita over SpeedBoost Torchic/ Protean Froakie

[ArthurZH]

So I haven't read all the posts because I'm on a phone, but in my opinion Tentacool should be at least 4th gym? I mean, we're getting stuff like Gengar, Gallade, and a whole lot of stuff. I actually found it annoying that I didn't get this weak thing around Serra or Noel but I already got Ralts, Azumarill and a whole lot more OU pokemon.

Please put in tenta, it's my favourite

Oh and Milotic too....while you're at it, maybe put the prism scale somewhere.....idk, post Noel? That would make it okay?

[Amethyst]

i think it was gulpin who got the axe this time

it's temporarily removed in 14.5. I have ever intention of putting it back in.

Maybe an incentive system so people would have a reason to pick Chikorita over SpeedBoost Torchic/ Protean Froakie

I kind of

like this actually

Not exactly sure how to justify it, but altering starting money based on tiers of starters might be interesting to help accommodate for Blaziken being a freelo piece of-- differing strengths between the starters.

But that's a different subject entirely.

[Azeria]

Thing is,even with lower money for different starters,people with Torchic&Combusken can quickly steamroll through most areas and gain money far quicker than say,someone with a Chikorita or Piplup.

[Deleted User]

it's temporarily removed in 14.5. I have ever intention of putting it back in.

I kind of

like this actually

Not exactly sure how to justify it, but altering starting money based on tiers of starters might be interesting to help accommodate for Blaziken being a freelo piece of-- differing strengths between the starters.

But that's a different subject entirely.

Here's a thought, give each starter a held item perhaps? Or an Egg move if they're lacking like Chikorita

[Amethyst]

I know it's not going to -solve- the problem, I don't expect it to. But if money is that helpful in the early game, it might open up some different choices.

[AuthorReborn]

Here's a thought, give each starter a held item perhaps? Or an Egg move if they're lacking like Chikorita

Now that sounds quite intruiging. Maybe give Chikorita Duel Screens to start with/ early game light clay.

[Commander]

I've got a better idea. Make it so that the top tier starters can't get their hidden ability unless by an egg. IE Froakie can't get Protean, and Blaziken can't get speed boost if that's possible. That'd certainly make people want to use other Pokemon.

[Lostelle]

I've got a better idea. Make it so that the top tier starters can't get their hidden ability unless by an egg. IE Froakie can't get Protean, and Blaziken can't get speed boost if that's possible. That'd certainly make people want to use other Pokemon.

Then most people will just overuse Chimchar or Torterra, etc.

[AuthorReborn]

I've got a better idea. Make it so that the top tier starters can't get their hidden ability unless by an egg. IE Froakie can't get Protean, and Blaziken can't get speed boost if that's possible. That'd certainly make people want to use other Pokemon.

That sounds nice until you consider the fact that Ability Capsules are scattered all over the land and most people have collected at least one.

[ShatteredSkys]

Now, excuse me if it's been said- but I think Deino could be fit in early game, or maybe mid game.. Why? Because it doesn't reach Hydreigon until a whopping level 65. If you have the dedication to stick with it for THAT long, congrats, you own a fairy magnet now. It IS extremely powerful, but it's something to think about- it'll be stuck as a Zweilous for a huge chunk of the current release, right?

Doesn't hustle Zweilous have the strongest outrage in the game or something?

[Chase]

There are WINGS and VIT-I-MINS out in them streets.

Money is not really much of an object.

[HakuTaku]

Huh. Starters holding items would be awesome but i would love more re-battles like the VS Seeker. I barely discover pokemon reborn and if a pokemon gets axed will that also remove it from my team?

Edited March 5, 2015 by HakuTaku

[Chase]

Pokémon previously caught are not removed from your team or boxes - they just won't be found previously where they were before.

[Personthing]

I think Electrike should be pushed back a bit. It's a bit ridiculous in the early game. Perhaps replace it with Tynamo? Tynamo takes a long while to evolve and even then I don't think it's too good.

[HakuTaku]

Pokémon previously caught are not removed from your team or boxes - they just won't be found previously where they were before.

Grazie~

[Sapp]

it's temporarily removed in 14.5. I have ever intention of putting it back in.

I kind of

like this actually

Not exactly sure how to justify it, but altering starting money based on tiers of starters might be interesting to help accommodate for Blaziken being a freelo piece of-- differing strengths between the starters.

But that's a different subject entirely.

Maybe different trades open up depending on what starter is chosen? Like have some people have the normal text speech if their starter is in certain "high tier", but if the trainer chose a "mid tier" or "low tier" starter, then that person can feel sorry/admiration for you and offer you a relatively easy trade for a good Pokemon that would otherwise be obtained later on (maybe like Gligar). This would be a non-monetary solution and offer an exclusive advantage to those who disadvantage themselves with poop starters (though a caveat to this is the trade would be activated say if you had like Bayleef in your party, as opposed to just Chikorita, so people don't just dump the starter for the trade).

Just an idea to consider.

[Chase]

Tynamo is definitely a Pokémon that would see more use if found much earlier, it's also a Pokémon that currently I feel is a viable alternative to Manectric after getting it to Eelektross.

Levitate is a pretty valuable ability on an Electric-type Pokémon - the question Tynamo draws however, is how the AI will approach it. If it's instinctively going for Ground Type Moves too often, Tynamo might be too good early on.

---

I also would love to see more trades in the game in general. I like the tiered starter idea as well.

Taking Blaziken, Chimchar, Mudkip, Froakie, Bulbasaurand Turtwig?/Chespin? could result in a harder starting experience such as getting mugged for a quarter of your starting cash (with the opportunity to hunt it down a la Paper Mario and the Thousand Year Door) and limited trade options.

Taking middle tier starters results in the opportunity for held items to show up earlier, along with avoiding misfortunes such as getting mugged.

Taking things like Chikorita, Treecko, Totodile, Squirtle, Charmander, and Fennekin would result in held items showing up early, increased earnings in some trainers, maybe the occasional trade opportunity as a service for picking a lower tier starter.

Of course, we would have to thoroughly discern which starters are which tier (Example - Totodile gets the incredible ability Sheer Force, but no stab physical Water move until level SIXTY)

[Deleted User]

If we're looking for pokemon to replace Electrike, then I'd suggest Helioptile that thing isn't good without TM's.

[dondon151]

Are you guys fucking kidding me. How does an incomprehensible rant about Talonflame supposedly being strong get upvotes? I don't understand.

Look at Fletchinder's level up moves. What's it going to do? Use a STAB Ember off base 56 spatk? Launch a 2-turn Razor Wind with no super effective coverage? Finish off an enemy with a priority Peck? The enemy sure is quivering in its boots.

It's atrocious before its final evolution into Talonflame. It's still bad afterwards because Talonflame's only remotely usable moves are Acrobatics at L44 and Flare Blitz and Brave Bird via move tutor. Do you know who else gets STAB Acrobatics at a lower level than Talonflame? Crobat. Crobat even has higher atk (on top of basically every other stat) than Talonflame and it reaches its final evolution earlier.

Move tutor has been pushed back to after the Sirius battle, at which point the average team level is approaching L50. This means that Talonflame doesn't get its best STABs until L50. Let that sink in for a moment: it's been nigh unusable until L44 when it actually learned a decent move, and it's only looking sunny beginning at L50. Who else gets Flare Blitz as STAB at or before L50?

- Growlithe gets Flare Blitz at L45.

- Rapidash gets Flare Blitz at L49.

- Flareon gets Flare Blitz at L45.

- Darmanitan gets Flare Blitz at L33 (!)

Every single one of these Pokemon in their final forms is substantially stronger than Talonflame.

Gale Wings. Gale Wings defines Talonflame in the OU metagame, but it's incredibly redundant in-game. You are playing against an AI. You do not need priority flying type moves when you already have 126 base spd.

Talonflame blows. It's a terrible in-game Pokemon that grows into an average in-game Pokemon. I'd encourage users to please look at the facts before blubbering nonsense, but I'm willing to bet that some just won't be convinced regardless of the evidence against them.

Edited March 5, 2015 by dondon151

[Deleted User]

dondon, while your points are valid and actually somewhat convincing, I need to ask that you make them in a more polite manner and try not to belittle your fellow Reborn community members for having opinions that differ from yours. Talonflame, while it doesn't work well early in the game, once it gets access to the move tutor would be kind of overpowered in the mid section of the game. It'd wipe the floor with Serra as it stands now. You can't consider just the early game when thinking of Pokemon to put in the early game.