Reborn Pokemon Project II (The actual work!~)

[Mashew]

[quote]Speed Stall

Stall Pokemon are slow and defensive, no? So, what about a speedy Pokemon, with the other attributes of a stalling Pokemon? One that's not fit to attack and attack, but actually defends using its Speed as an asset? "QuickStall" teams are nothing new to most Uber players, teams built to stall with fast and semi-frail Pokemon. This Pokemon would pretty much be just this, though perhaps with some more defensive capabilities. This Pokemon would also really bring a whole new dimension to stall teams, an inclusion that strays away from weaknesses of most stalling Pokemon, and adds more variety for the player and the opponent. However, such a Pokemon would have merits outside stall teams; a speedy wall/tank Pokemon can migitate the downsides of offensive teams requiring to use slower walls that will slow down their tempo.[/quote]

So here is where we get the project really going!!! The actual work!!!~ Let's get a check list, shall we?~

[size="4"][i][b][X] Typing (Steel/Ghost)
[] Base Stats
[] Appearance/Spriting
[] Ability/Abilities
[] Movepool
[] Name
[] Strategy
[] Battle Cry?[/b][/i][/size]

Now come on Reborn, Let's get another one done so we can move on!!!~

[Rodaku]

after looking at typings and all that to see what would works, i came up with the three best possible ideas (in my opinion) that might work

Ice/poison, ice types are generically fast so it would easily help, and being poison it can stall out with a generic poison, sub, recover or rest combo, along with the fact that it only resists grass, ice, poison, and bug which arn't that common but makes it easy to get rid of things like toxic spikes, the weakness being fire, ground, psychic, rock, and steel, which are mostly the most OU types in the game

Dark/poison, Poison cloud of death anyone, this typing actually gives it more stuff like sucker punch, taunt (thou most pokemon have that).... thats all i got..... Resists grass, poison, ghost and dark... and is weak to..... ground..... thats it

Electric/ice, Electric and ice, two of the fastest types in the game, combine the both and what do you get.... Fucked up speeds nothing might be able to beat, thou it can easily get electric moves like thunder wave and that making it very speedy for its speed stalliness or whatever you wanna call it, the resistances here are electric, ice and flying.... flying and electric types... .you might find here while its weakness are fire, fighting, ground and rock more or less again, same types mostly in OU

[Voctrode]

I can completely agree with one of the above atleast, as poison/dark is a good defensive type, especially on a Pokemon who's looks make me always think it's a bug. [Fucking Drapion :c]

The other two having Ice in them though.. I kinda went "wut, ice as a defense type while still being fast? lolno."

That said, there's another slightly obvious type combination to consider:

[b]Dark/Ghost[/b]: I'm slightly put off by this choice because we already MADE a Ghost type with Grimolt. Nevertheless, the fact that this type combination gives a Pokemon absolutely no weakness, as well as resistance to poison [so common >_>,] and of course complete immunity to Normal, Psychic, and Fighting, the latter two in which ARE pretty common. Insert an ability such as Levitate, Flash Fire, Water Absorb or Volt Absorb, or take it in the other direction with things like Status Affliction abilities, Prankster [Though then it'd just be a better Sableye :c] [s]Wonderguard[/s], or Magic Mirror and you have a nice little troll if you actually give it the stats to use its type.

Base Stats are tricky cause we don't want this thing to be too over the top. High HP and Speed are the biggest essentials, obviously. It's a staller so the attack stats shouldn't be that high, however, moves like Nasty Plot and such would be cool for a surprise novelty set, so making them Chansey status wouldn't really be great either.

Appearance? Lolidk. Soon as we pick the type is when that can come into play.

Movepool? Typical Stalling moves I guess. Recover, Roost maybe if it ends up having wings or.. flying of some kind. Toxic, Will-o-Wisp especially if it's half-Ghost, maybe Cosmic Power if it's designed to be able to have it. Pretty much just your typical moveset for something that wants to stall shit :c

When Appearance is done, that'll be a bit more able to be said.

The strategy seems to be that you'd do what a typical staller does, but faster. Status, heal, peck away at, heal, set up entry hazards, heal, did I mention heal? It could also Dual Screen, set up a trick room by surprise seeing as it's designed to be fast, or hell, fuck shit with Wonder Room, and.. the other room. I think one of the best things a staller could do is be unpredictable. If you know it's gonna toxic stall, you're just gonna bring in a steel type and be "klol." With many different types into one pokemon while keeping the ability to go first, you control how the battle can be either stalled directly, or from a distance. Insert bullet calling me an idiot here << >>

Battle Cry? lol.

[Amethyst]

As a type suggestion, perhaps Dark/Psychic? Very similar to Dark/Ghost, but not done yet. One immunity, one resist, one weakness (and not a common attacking type, like with Scizor's one weakness)

[Bullet]

Preliminary suggestions

Type: Steel/Ghost
-Unique
-People here seem to like Ghost/Dark/Psychic
-Immune to: Poison, Fighting, Normal
-Immune to Spikes, and resists Stealth Rock
-Resists: Grass, Bug, Steel, Rock, Ice, Dragon, Psychic, Flying
-Neutral againt: Water, Electric, Dark, Ghost
-Weak to: Fire, Ground
-Generally badass typing

Stats:
-HP: somewhere around base 90ish?(think Politoed, legendary birds, Machamp, etc.)
-Attack and Special Attack: somewhere from base 70 - 80. Quite mediocre.
-Defense: 100ish(Pixies, and other mid-level bulk Pokemon such as Feraligatr)
-Sp Def: 80ish. fairly average, Pokemon with unspectacular Sp Def such as Scizor, Flygon, Azumarill, etc.
-Speed: Either
a. 146-149(faster than anything not Deoxys or Ninjask)
b. 141-144(faster than electrode, slower than accelgor)
c. 131-139(faster than base 130s, slower than Electrode)
d. 126-129(faster than Weavile and Swellow, slower than base 130s)

Movepool
-Status moves such as Will o Wisp, Toxic, and maybe Hypnosis
-Generic moves such as Substitute and Protect
-Encore
-Recover or an identical move
-Flavor moves such as Curse, Metal Sound, Night Shade, etc.
-STAB moves such as Shadow Claw and Flash Cannon
-Other attacking moves such as Flamethrower, Thunderbolt, etc.
-Gimmick options such as Nasty Plot, Dual Screens, etc.

[Rodaku]

well looking at those stats i would say that speeds from a or b would be a bit good, considering this thing is gonna be Really frail to most attacks and can barely cause real damage, true the def may be fine but if we got some low hp and sp. def, it will need that speed to actually manage to stop itself from dieing in a way

[Ikaru]

I'll say more when it's not 4 AM, but, I'm with Bullet in terms of typing; at least the steel half, anyway. If we're gonna make something stall, we want resistances, and lots of them. Steel just so happens to be the type with a lot of resistances. Not quite known for their speed, however, so... It's a little iffy. Currently, the fastest steel types are Cobalion and Durant, at 108 and 109 base, respectively... That's... Not fast. Not in a metagame with scarfed pokemon running around freely; some of which are Fire-type or carry Fire attacks.

Anyway I guess my point is, before any details, I'm at least voting that the Pokemon in question ends up being part Steel. The sheer amount of resistances would be welcomed on a Pokemon meant to stall. As much as a Dark/Psychic type would be cool, I like not having a 4x weakness to any given type; ironic that Amethyst would suggest a typing 4x weak to bug? =P

Also,
[quote name='Rodaku' timestamp='1310696580' post='17890']
well looking at those stats i would say that speeds from a or b would be a bit good, considering this thing is gonna be Really frail to most attacks and can barely cause real damage, true the def may be fine but if we got some low hp and sp. def, it will need that speed to actually manage to stop itself from dieing in a way
[/quote]
I really hope I'm misreading or you made a terrible mistake, because what sense does a frail staller make...?

[color="#00bfff"]Well, it's supposed to be semi-frail. Bullet was here.
[/color][color="#800080"]Gotcha, but "Really frail" =/= "semi-frail" soooo I was confused.[/color]

[MasterShaper]

Interesting concept... a speedy stall pokemon.

Considering that most stall teams seem to be centered around weather, I suggest the following pokemon - might be interesting.

Since Bullet already proposed Ghost/Steel (I definitely love that pairing), here's something else I've been thinking about

Couldn't help it - I just like ghosts.

---

Ghost/Fighting
- No double weaknesses
- Weaknesses: Ghost/Psychic/Flying
- Resistances: Bug/Rock/Poison
- Immunities: Fighting/Normal
- Reduces the effectiveness of an opponent's Sucker Punch or Pursuit
- Has STAB against one of its type weaknesses (Psychic)
- Has STAB against an opposing type that normally nulls one of its types (Normal)
- Immune to Mach Punch and Vacuum Wave (I'm looking at you, breloom and conkeldurr)

Stats:
- HP: Maybe 90-100
- Atk/SAtk: Maybe 60-80
- Def/SDef: Maybe 90-100
- Speed: Maybe 110-120

Appearance:
- For some reason, I like the idea of clothes that have no wearer. Maybe a haunted judo outfit or something - would go with Overcoat. Think the Phantom from Kingdom Hearts to get a general idea of how I see it (incidentally, I somehow always envisioned a Ghost/Steel type to be an animated suit of armor).

Possible Abilities:
- Overcoat (for weather)
- Intimidate (hell, it's a ghost, ?)
- Cursed Body (haunted shit)
- Levitate (more haunted shit)
- Pressure (... it's a ghost)
- Mummy (gimmicky, but useful sometimes)
- Shed Skin (would also go with the suggestion of a haunted clothing item)
- Wonder Skin (similar to Shed Skin)
- Speed Boost (just because it's a speedy staller)

Movepool:
- Status moves such as Will-O-Wisp, Toxic, and Hypnosis
- Recovery moves such as Recover and Moonlight
- Defensive moves such as Substitute or Double Team
- Perish Song (could possibly be horrible if a Tagged chandelure was an ally)
- Priority moves to put targets out of their misery if needed (its typing alone would give it possible access to Sucker Punch, Vacuum Wave, Pursuit, and Shadow Sneak - Mach Punch sounds hilarious for something dead)

Strategy:
- Umm, stall? Use its speed to inflict status problems on opponents and get your Substitute or whatever up. Then just pepper the opponent with hits to annoy them further.

---

Just as a suggestion - doesn't really do much beyond what ghosts normally do, but has the capability to give those bastard eggs (a.k.a. blissey and Eviolite chansey) a run for their money if things came down to a stalling match.

[Mashew]

Poll closes today so get those votes in!~

[Mashew]

Well we decided on Steel/Ghost. Now let's get some ideas for abilities going! Come on people!

[Mashew]

[quote](21:38) Setsuna: Levitate and/or Heat Proof seems ideal (iirc what Heat Proof does..)
(21:39) Setsuna: Maybe Levitate as primary, Heat Proof as secondary or DW
(21:39) Setsuna: <<[/quote]

[Voctrode]

Seems like the best idea. Being as Ghosts are known to have a natural chill to them, and.. they levitate, you wouldn't need any special design simply for the ability.

[EssGeezuz]

Wonder Guard :C

[Bullet]

I second(third?) Levitate xd

[AZKnight]

I am reluctant to give it Levitate, but definitely against giving it both Levitate and Heatproof. If you do the latter, you might as well announce that it's a Bronzong clone, but Ghost instead Psychic! It is a good combination. I feel this is best reflected by the fact that Bronzong is the only Pokemon with Levitate that has other abilities. For everything else, if you have Levitate that's all you get. For Bronzong there is a trade off. It is weak to both Ground and Fire, and Levitate and Heat Proof provide an immunity and resistance to these two types. It allows it to choose which weakness to get rid of. In addition to this, the three types that Psychic is weak to (Bug, Ghost and Dark), Steel resists, meaning Bronzong takes neutral to them and leaving Ground and Fire it's only weaknesses. The two abilities thus feel balanced because you can get rid of one weakness, but not both. With it's type combination alone, Bronzong is only weak to two types, and this can be reduced to just one depending on which ability it has.

Now Ghost has two built in [i]immunities[/i] to Normal and Fighting. Now with a Steel/Ghost Pokemon, the normal immunity is not that important because Steel already resists Normal. It is the immunity to Fighting that is important, because that completely eliminates one of the three weaknesses that Steel has. It doesn't just make it neutral like Bug becomes against Steel/Psychic, it makes it immune. And I'm cautious about that. With the type combination of Steel/Ghost, the Pokemon would have three immunities (Normal, Fighting, Poison), eight resists (Flying, Rock, Bug, Steel, Grass, Psychic, Ice, Dragon), four normal (Ghost, Water, Electric, Dark) and two weaknesses (Ground and Fire). That is pretty damn good in my opinion if not scary. Really scary if it has Levitate making one of those weaknesses and immunity. There are only two Pokemon I can think to compare that to and those are Bronzong and Spiritomb. Now Spiritomb also has three natural immunities thanks to its type combination, but the difference is its resistances; it only has one, Poison. The other thirteen types Spiritomb takes neutral damage from. The majority of things can still hit it really hard.

If we go the Defensive route for a Steel/Ghost Pokemon, which I predict we will because its...Steel, I would be willing to give it one of those. But only one. Again, giving it both just feels like it would be a clone of Bronzong. And even if you don't feel that way, look at Pokemon with Levitate. All of them save Bronzong have Levitate as a singular ability. If we give our Pokemon Levitate, I feel we should continue that tradition. However, if another good combination comes up that makes sense, fun, balanced then I will gladly change my stance. I just can't think of anything balances well with Levitate. If we gave it Heat Proof then I am much more open to potential second abilities. Oh, and let's not forget about Dream World, which means we could go up to three abilities.

Now after all that nitpicking and nagging, which will most likely be met with 'lol wrong', I don't have any suggestions right now. It's hard for me to think of abilities solely based on type. Whenever I think about abilities, I think about the design of the Pokemon. Rough Skin doesn't scream Water, but when applied to Sharpedo, which is designed after sharks which have rough skins, then it makes a world of sense. I'll have to give it more thought but I don't know if I can break out of my confined thinking pattern. Anyway, those are my thoughts on the two suggested abilities of Levitate and Heat Proof.

[Bullet]

Course, that's rather problematic; we don't even have the design aspect down. We're fleshing things out based on battling aspects, with minimal regard for flavor aspects. Soooo, we might as well decide whatever we want for abilities, given it's not something ridiculous like Wonder Guard.

[Amethyst]

Or put the ability on hold and do the design now.

[MasterShaper]

Just my humble suggestions for both the abilities and the design

For the design, may I propose a possessed suit of armor? Golurk's already set the precedent for an automaton-like ghost, and so it should be workable.

From there, it stands to reason that the abilities could be along the lines of Battle Armor, Broken Armor, or Sturdy (which do fit steel-types, anyway).

Come to think of it, a ghost with Sturdy may indeed be formidable, given how nasty the likes of golurk have already proven themselves to be. May sound like it defeats the purpose of a speedy staller, but do keep in mind that if it's fast but can't take hits, it might as well not exist XD

[Amethyst]

Living Armor Pokemon... It's perfect for the type.

[Rodaku]

living armor, like a dulahan [s]then again, they do have head but yea... there gone[/s]

[Maelstrom]

... I voted against speed stall because stallers already have prankster- a move that let's non-attacking moves go first. And if a staller is not fit for attacking but setting up... why give it the speed when they have priority already?

[Rodaku]

because im thinking we should maybe keep this thing from dieing [s]lol, its a ghost type, its already dead[/s] i think we should get to back to work... i think, we do have the do know what the design is gonna look like at least

[Rodaku]

OK, Seeing as i am bringing this to life so we can get to works on the RPP and gets our own generation (Ha ha ha... no) let us get back to work. Anyways, we said its a suit of armor of some sort yes? thats a somewhat good design... so yea, now we just got to think about the abilitys ok, WORK TIME GO

[Cardshark000]

As for abilities... levitate is standard fare for ghosts, as is cursed body. Iron fist might also work depending on the design... there's also shadow tag if you feel like making something broken... finally i can see tinted lens working to help boost the thing's attacking prowess (design withstanding). that's what I can see working for this pokemon.

[Kiozo]

About the suit of armor; I'm not opposed to it entirely. Thing is, just like a literal floating suit of armor isn't really appealing in a sense to my normal idea of Pokemon. There's still some general animalistic quality to them. Example: Escalivier [spelling ;-;] is a weird bug pokemon that is completely in a shell of armor. The armor itself is large and complete: but there is still a quality of animal to it.

I was thinking about the typing and I can't stop thinking about Smogon's CAP, Kitsunoh, Which was the same type. It referenced an animal with masks on its side, to show that there was a lore base there and yet, still had the idea of an animal and pulled a very origional concept out. We could do something where the ghost resembles a Pokemon but also is entwined with Armor for whatever reason. If there's Lore involved, ?

First off, hahaha wynaut pic. second edit. I think the design concepts would greatly play into this like it would the movepool...?