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Arlonen

[Spoilers] Prophecies Speculation

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So I recently started a run through on intense mode, and now that I'm nearly finished with it, I thought that I would do some speculation on the prophecies of Light and Dark. That said, this will contain spoilers on V10 and minor spoilers for Episode -1, so the rest of this post will be in a spoiler. Read ahead at your own risk, you have been warned. This is a bit long winded, but I think is an interesting conversation to have. I apologize if this is currently being discussed elsewhere, but I did not see another post for this that occurs after V10.

Spoiler

I am going to assume that anyone reading this knows the prophecies of Light and Dark, if not, go to the hidden library and find the plaque there where both are listed. Please note that this is my own speculation, and will not necessarily wind up being the case. We currently know nothing about the lights other than they are not born of man. However, we do know a bit amount about the darknesses other than they are born of man. 


At Blacksteeple Castle, we can find what is essentially a second verse or addendum to the Prophecy of Dark. This states that the four darknesses embody certain attributes. These being pure evil, obsession, betrayal, and greed. Based off the events of V10, it is fairly obvious that Nim (Lorna) is the darkness of pure evil. This is again confirmed by Damien who states that she is evil and will bring about the end of the world. It is possible that Madame X is instead the darkness of pure evil, but at this point I feel much more confident saying that Nim is this darkness.


The next darkness that we have information on is the darkness of betrayal. Based on the current events of the game, we are led to believe that the darkness of betrayal is Ren given that he betrays our trust and joins Team Xen. It is stated by the admins present when he joins that he fits the bill of the darkness of betrayal. However, I believe that there is a second possibility. I believe that it is possible that Crescent could be this darkness as well. She betrayed everyone who knows about the past by splitting off from the group and going rogue. She is the one who sets Ren on his path of betrayal as well as Nim by modifying her memories and naming her Lorna. This would make her not only commit acts of betrayal, but inspire acts of betrayal in others, which would be exactly what we might expect the darkness of betrayal to do.


We know considerably less about the darknesses of obsession and greed than the other two. A few candidates that I have for obsession are Kanon, Angie and possibly Crescent if she does not wind up being the darkness of betrayal. Kanon fits the bill in my opinion due to his obsession over Melia. Plus we see him storm off in V10, which may set him on a path against the main group. Angie also fits the bill for obvious reasons here due to here fanatical obsession over Arceus and the Church of Theolia (I think this is what it is called, but I may be mistaken). Finally, Crescent's obsession with the destruction of Team Xen could lead her to being the darkness of obsession. As for greed, we don't have anyone that really fits the bill here. Its possible that Thomas Blakeory could fit the bill here based on what little we saw of him in this version, but that is a bit of  a stretch. We at least know that the Blakeory family does not have a great track record. In the same vein, Saki could fit the bill here, but in my opinion, that is an even larger stretch as we have no reason to believe that she is a darkness. These two darknesses are still very much up for debate, and I would love to hear some other opinions on them.


Moving onto the lights, based on the events of V10, it is all but outright stated that both Melia and Aelita are two of the lights. Both are not born of man and have displayed a high degree of inhuman power. I'm not even sure if this is debatable anymore, but feel free to discuss on whether they are or not. The more interesting discussion on the lights to be had though, is who the other two lights are. My theories on this are that they are either Spacea and Tiempa, Cosmia and Comet, or the main protagonist (the player) and Erin. Spacea and Tiempa fit the bill here as they are both not born of man and have considerable power as we have seen time and again. Cosmia and Comet we have seen very little of, but they have shown displays of power that we might expect of two of the lights (although Comet seems to be having issues with his powers). 


The player and Erin I think are the most likely to be the remaining lights in my opinion. The main player has been shown to be unable to die (a trait seemingly shared by Aelita through reincarnation, and Melia with different versions of her existing and Angie being unable to sacrifice her) and has been referred to as the Interceptor. I believe that name is a result of something similar to the second verse of the Prophecy of Dark. There is likely a second verse to the Prophecy of Light that lists characteristics of the lights. The interceptor is one of those, in my opinion. Finally, it is very likely that the player was not born of man since it is all but stated that the player's mom is a robot programmed to protect the player. 


As for Erin, this is a bit of a stretch. (I have not gotten to this point in my most recent play through, so forgive me if I get some details wrong here.) Erin previously states that Souta is his grandfather, but it is later revealed that Souta only ever married Cella, and they don't seem to have children, or we would have seen them in Episode -1 when she moved to Sheridan. This makes it impossible for Souta to be Erin's grandfather (unless she is adopted, but that doesn't interfere with where I am going with this). Since we don't know where she came from, or who her parents are, it is entirely possible she was not born of man. As for her powers, they may lie dormant similar to Melia's and Aelita's. This one is also a stretch, and has very little backing evidence, but is a possibility.


Finally, I want to talk about the Prophecies themselves, more specifically, how they will come about. At face value, it seems that they are both opposite from each other and both cannot happen. This makes sense since one predicts the destruction of the world, and the other the salvation of it. I am of the opinion that both prophecies must come to pass. In this scenario, I believe that the darknesses will bring about the end of the world, and that only through the power of the lights will the world be saved. Similar to the do nothing ending of the alternate reality created in V10 where Melia saves the world. It will be through the power of the lights that the world is saved after the darknesses have destroyed it.

 

In short, my opinions on the lights and darknesses are as follows:

Darknesses: Nim (Pure Evil), Crescent (Betrayal), Kanon (Obsession), Thomas Blakeory or some unintroduced character (Greed)

Lights: Melia, Aelita, the Player (the Interceptor), Erin


I have rambled on long enough, but I would love to discuss this theory with anyone who has read this far. Who do you thing the lights and darknesses are and why? Please feel free to bring up anything I missed or got wrong!

 

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1 hour ago, Arlonen said:

So I recently started a run through on intense mode, and now that I'm nearly finished with it, I thought that I would do some speculation on the prophecies of Light and Dark. That said, this will contain spoilers on V10 and minor spoilers for Episode -1, so the rest of this post will be in a spoiler. Read ahead at your own risk, you have been warned. This is a bit long winded, but I think is an interesting conversation to have. I apologize if this is currently being discussed elsewhere, but I did not see another post for this that occurs after V10.

  Reveal hidden contents

I am going to assume that anyone reading this knows the prophecies of Light and Dark, if not, go to the hidden library and find the plaque there where both are listed. Please note that this is my own speculation, and will not necessarily wind up being the case. We currently know nothing about the lights other than they are not born of man. However, we do know a bit amount about the darknesses other than they are born of man. 


At Blacksteeple Castle, we can find what is essentially a second verse or addendum to the Prophecy of Dark. This states that the four darknesses embody certain attributes. These being pure evil, obsession, betrayal, and greed. Based off the events of V10, it is fairly obvious that Nim (Lorna) is the darkness of pure evil. This is again confirmed by Damien who states that she is evil and will bring about the end of the world. It is possible that Madame X is instead the darkness of pure evil, but at this point I feel much more confident saying that Nim is this darkness.


The next darkness that we have information on is the darkness of betrayal. Based on the current events of the game, we are led to believe that the darkness of betrayal is Ren given that he betrays our trust and joins Team Xen. It is stated by the admins present when he joins that he fits the bill of the darkness of betrayal. However, I believe that there is a second possibility. I believe that it is possible that Crescent could be this darkness as well. She betrayed everyone who knows about the past by splitting off from the group and going rogue. She is the one who sets Ren on his path of betrayal as well as Nim by modifying her memories and naming her Lorna. This would make her not only commit acts of betrayal, but inspire acts of betrayal in others, which would be exactly what we might expect the darkness of betrayal to do.


We know considerably less about the darknesses of obsession and greed than the other two. A few candidates that I have for obsession are Kanon, Angie and possibly Crescent if she does not wind up being the darkness of betrayal. Kanon fits the bill in my opinion due to his obsession over Melia. Plus we see him storm off in V10, which may set him on a path against the main group. Angie also fits the bill for obvious reasons here due to here fanatical obsession over Arceus and the Church of Theolia (I think this is what it is called, but I may be mistaken). Finally, Crescent's obsession with the destruction of Team Xen could lead her to being the darkness of obsession. As for greed, we don't have anyone that really fits the bill here. Its possible that Thomas Blakeory could fit the bill here based on what little we saw of him in this version, but that is a bit of  a stretch. We at least know that the Blakeory family does not have a great track record. In the same vein, Saki could fit the bill here, but in my opinion, that is an even larger stretch as we have no reason to believe that she is a darkness. These two darknesses are still very much up for debate, and I would love to hear some other opinions on them.


Moving onto the lights, based on the events of V10, it is all but outright stated that both Melia and Aelita are two of the lights. Both are not born of man and have displayed a high degree of inhuman power. I'm not even sure if this is debatable anymore, but feel free to discuss on whether they are or not. The more interesting discussion on the lights to be had though, is who the other two lights are. My theories on this are that they are either Spacea and Tiempa, Cosmia and Comet, or the main protagonist (the player) and Erin. Spacea and Tiempa fit the bill here as they are both not born of man and have considerable power as we have seen time and again. Cosmia and Comet we have seen very little of, but they have shown displays of power that we might expect of two of the lights (although Comet seems to be having issues with his powers). 


The player and Erin I think are the most likely to be the remaining lights in my opinion. The main player has been shown to be unable to die (a trait seemingly shared by Aelita through reincarnation, and Melia with different versions of her existing and Angie being unable to sacrifice her) and has been referred to as the Interceptor. I believe that name is a result of something similar to the second verse of the Prophecy of Dark. There is likely a second verse to the Prophecy of Light that lists characteristics of the lights. The interceptor is one of those, in my opinion. Finally, it is very likely that the player was not born of man since it is all but stated that the player's mom is a robot programmed to protect the player. 


As for Erin, this is a bit of a stretch. (I have not gotten to this point in my most recent play through, so forgive me if I get some details wrong here.) Erin previously states that Souta is his grandfather, but it is later revealed that Souta only ever married Cella, and they don't seem to have children, or we would have seen them in Episode -1 when she moved to Sheridan. This makes it impossible for Souta to be Erin's grandfather (unless she is adopted, but that doesn't interfere with where I am going with this). Since we don't know where she came from, or who her parents are, it is entirely possible she was not born of man. As for her powers, they may lie dormant similar to Melia's and Aelita's. This one is also a stretch, and has very little backing evidence, but is a possibility.


Finally, I want to talk about the Prophecies themselves, more specifically, how they will come about. At face value, it seems that they are both opposite from each other and both cannot happen. This makes sense since one predicts the destruction of the world, and the other the salvation of it. I am of the opinion that both prophecies must come to pass. In this scenario, I believe that the darknesses will bring about the end of the world, and that only through the power of the lights will the world be saved. Similar to the do nothing ending of the alternate reality created in V10 where Melia saves the world. It will be through the power of the lights that the world is saved after the darknesses have destroyed it.

 

In short, my opinions on the lights and darknesses are as follows:

Darknesses: Nim (Pure Evil), Crescent (Betrayal), Kanon (Obsession), Thomas Blakeory or some unintroduced character (Greed)

Lights: Melia, Aelita, the Player (the Interceptor), Erin


I have rambled on long enough, but I would love to discuss this theory with anyone who has read this far. Who do you thing the lights and darknesses are and why? Please feel free to bring up anything I missed or got wrong!

 

Spoiler

Mostly lines up with what I've been thinking. Erin is a decent candidate for being a light, and I think Kanon could probably actually go either way (because we do have him, or some version of him, giving Vivian the spell to prevent the first storm-9, among other things).

The player as the interceptor feels more like an independent party, a 'wild card' of sorts, and could potentially be the decider of which of the two prophecies come to pass (unless they both do). 

I think Indriad/Gardevoir are also good candidates for one of the shadows. 

I'm not feeling spacia/tiempa/cosmia/comet as candidates, though maybe if Griselda shows up in some capacity, she could be the shadow of greed or something. 

there are also some other mysterious characters to consider, like the 'father' that's been referred to a couple times in connection with Yveltal/blacksteeple, and the redhead time traveller in V-1

 

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Fortune Teller: "There lies on top the castle you (MC) and 3 other of your friends fight against a woman wearing armor. One with a heart of gold, one who leads others and one who fights for a lost loved one." Just something to think about. My assumption of the 4 lights. (Fortune Tellers words of the future in GDC, missing childen sidequest)

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1 hour ago, DreamblitzX said:
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Mostly lines up with what I've been thinking. Erin is a decent candidate for being a light, and I think Kanon could probably actually go either way (because we do have him, or some version of him, giving Vivian the spell to prevent the first storm-9, among other things).

The player as the interceptor feels more like an independent party, a 'wild card' of sorts, and could potentially be the decider of which of the two prophecies come to pass (unless they both do). 

I think Indriad/Gardevoir are also good candidates for one of the shadows. 

I'm not feeling spacia/tiempa/cosmia/comet as candidates, though maybe if Griselda shows up in some capacity, she could be the shadow of greed or something. 

there are also some other mysterious characters to consider, like the 'father' that's been referred to a couple times in connection with Yveltal/blacksteeple, and the redhead time traveller in V-1

 

Spoiler

I do agree that Kanon could go either way, but I think his diary in the past claims that he had human parents, so I'm not sure he could be a light. This is another thing that I meant to bring up. I'm not sure that the darknesses are purposely going to bring about the end of the world, just that they will be responsible. This means that someone could have all the best intentions, but wind up being a darkness. Hence why I think Ren and Crescent have the potential to be darknesses. I don't think either of them wants to destroy the world, but they might do so unintentionally. 

 

This was another thought that I had as well, where the Interceptor could almost be a third prophecy that we just don't know about yet. I personally believe the interceptor will be a light. I think that both are equally possible though and only time will tell which comes to pass.

 

Indriad is possible, but I lump him in with Angie since there was a short hidden cutscene before we fight Angie that showed Anju and Indriad essentially fusing together to form Angie.

 

I agree that those 4 are very unlikely, but I threw them in there because as far as we know, they could fit the bill.

 

I may have missed the mention of "father" was that in alternate timeline Blacksteeple, or when we first went there? I'm still not sure what to make of the time traveler in V-1. I want to see if she shows up in the main story before making any judgements on her.

 

25 minutes ago, Xukai said:

Fortune Teller: "There lies on top the castle you (MC) and 3 other of your friends fight against a woman wearing armor. One with a heart of gold, one who leads others and one who fights for a lost loved one." Just something to think about. My assumption of the 4 lights. (Fortune Tellers words of the future in GDC, missing childen sidequest)

Spoiler

I remember reading somewhere that this refered to the alternate timeline in V10, but reading through it now, I'm not sure that's the case. It doesn't seem to fit, especially since we were fighting with Madame X (the woman in armor) not against.

 

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3 hours ago, Arlonen said:
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I do agree that Kanon could go either way, but I think his diary in the past claims that he had human parents, so I'm not sure he could be a light. This is another thing that I meant to bring up. I'm not sure that the darknesses are purposely going to bring about the end of the world, just that they will be responsible. This means that someone could have all the best intentions, but wind up being a darkness. Hence why I think Ren and Crescent have the potential to be darknesses. I don't think either of them wants to destroy the world, but they might do so unintentionally. 

 

This was another thought that I had as well, where the Interceptor could almost be a third prophecy that we just don't know about yet. I personally believe the interceptor will be a light. I think that both are equally possible though and only time will tell which comes to pass.

 

Indriad is possible, but I lump him in with Angie since there was a short hidden cutscene before we fight Angie that showed Anju and Indriad essentially fusing together to form Angie.

 

I agree that those 4 are very unlikely, but I threw them in there because as far as we know, they could fit the bill.

 

I may have missed the mention of "father" was that in alternate timeline Blacksteeple, or when we first went there? I'm still not sure what to make of the time traveler in V-1. I want to see if she shows up in the main story before making any judgements on her.

 

  Hide contents

I remember reading somewhere that this refered to the alternate timeline in V10, but reading through it now, I'm not sure that's the case. It doesn't seem to fit, especially since we were fighting with Madame X (the woman in armor) not against.

 

Spoiler

The "father" has been mentioned both by Madame X at the initial blacksteeple (it is or was her defeat text if you managed to take down Yveltal) and also by Melanie in the alternate future before Yveltal shows up. 

 

I had the exact wording of the prophecy on a stickynote up until a couple days ago (annoyed at myself for deleting it now) and I don't think it mentioned the woman being in armour. (might be thinking of the reborn prophecy mentioning titania). From memory it was along the lines of "woman who wishes to destroy everything and everyone" which is pretty close to what Melanie was doing with destroying all other landmasses. I know that before V10, one of my notes next to that line was (Angie?), which I wouldn't have put if it mentioned Armour. I was pretty convinced after V10 that the prophecy fit the alternate timeline. 

 

Also It's hard to tell just from some simple sprite movements, but I didn't interpret the angie cutscene as them fusing, more just of him corrupting her mind and soul. because she's like an Uber cultist maid, and there are a bunch of those, so it shouldn't require fusing

 

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I agree with the fact that The MC may be a third party , just because of some lines Madame X shared with Him while we went first time in the past something along the lines ;; Why are you where you werent here in the first place;; and also the fact that he is the INTERCEPTOR leaving me to belive that he is there just like you guys said a third party and doesnt have anything to do with the prophecies ( i may be wrong tho and he may be actualy one of the lights or event darkness)... or the universe trying to fix itself but that is very unlikely.

 

As for the Darkness the Xenpurgis (i dont know if its correct) may be one , as the Puppet Master said that We should fear him ( We the MC) and we have yet to see him.

 

P.S. I dont think Melia is imortal she just has different versions of herself in different Time Lines.

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